Universe Club/Kousai Clubs/Sugar Babies

Well so long, I guess you are on your own now.

meiji said:

Yeah, I think it's time to move on. We should be discussing the topic at hand, not other users. I think Muku1's advice to add users to your Ignore List if you don't like their posting styles, is a good one.

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Will do! Hopefully noone will quote his posts, otherwise they will reappear by the back door..
Solong!!
And BTW, thanks to everyone for all their reports,good or bad!!

Use a little brain power and stop being childish. Only a scam artist wants to block the opinions of others, because they have a vested interest in hiding a scam. To value reports good or bad, means ALL reports. Censorship is the home of the foolish.

Intelligent people are capable of understanding and valuing different opinions.

Solong said:

Use a little brain power and stop being childish. Only a scam artist wants to block the opinions of others, because they have a vested interest in hiding a scam. To value reports good or bad, means ALL reports. Censorship is the home the foolish.

Intelligent people are capable of understanding and valuing different opinions.

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Let's move on as Meiji mentioned above. Everyone has said what they wanted to say so let's get back on topic and try and leave all bad vibes at the door when you come in.

Censorship is avoided at all possible costs, excepting some explicitly necessary cases.

I will be giving UC a try sometime reasonably soon, probably at the gold level, and will report my experience(s) here at some point.

I have quite a bit of experience in the sugar bowl and in mongering of many sorts (enough to *know* that there is a vast difference between being with a Sugar Baby vs with a conventional pro-export), so I think I can figure out how to proceed reasonably well on my own. Nevertheless, I'd appreciate any advice about how to present/profile myself; the potential SBs see profiles of SDs who want to meet them, right? Also I'd appreciate any tips about how to best pick an SB, on what to plan for a first date, on how to handle the financial and physical sides of the first and later dates etc. Basically, I'm looking for info on any conventions/customs/norms or insider info/techniques in this slightly new (to me) version of sugar dating. Thanks in advance...

Btw, I'm more interested in a novel/unconventional experience and connection than simply a sexual encounter. I can reasonably easily afford to purchase more of the latter than I have time or (at my age) physical capacity to enjoy. The former, however, are far more precious and difficult to find.

-Ww

Hope I can help...

The guys only have a basic profile, name, age and occupation. I am not even sure if it is visible to the girls as all offers are one way, i.e. guys offer dates to girls, and I think then the girls are given the guys basic details. No pics are involved. And you profile info can be false if need be. I am guessing some girls use some false profile info too. On fact I know they do as they have fessed up on the date or later dates once they felt comfortable.

For restaurants I have ranged from Y12,000 to Y30,000. The more expensive have been for follow up dates when I had a good connection with a girl. I can see this being criticized but it is my choice.

I have handled the payment via an envelope together with a small box of chocolates. Seems to work OK. None of the girls have ever asked for the payment and I have given it to them at the end of the night.

Also with you on this being more than just the after dinner fun. I have spent the afternoon and evening with girls on follow up dates, 8 hours plus, and it has been a lot of fun.

Some may feel the need to be critical on all this but I think it is only valid if you've given it a try.

SN

Wwanderer said:

I will be giving UC a try sometime reasonably soon, probably at the gold level, and will report my experience(s) here at some point.

I have quite a bit of experience in the sugar bowl and in mongering of many sorts (enough to *know* that there is a vast difference between being with a Sugar Baby vs with a conventional pro-export), so I think I can figure out how to proceed reasonably well on my own. Nevertheless, I'd appreciate any advice about how to present/profile myself; the potential SBs see profiles of SDs who want to meet them, right? Also I'd appreciate any tips about how to best pick an SB, on what to plan for a first date, on how to handle the financial and physical sides of the first and later dates etc. Basically, I'm looking for info on any conventions/customs/norms or insider info/techniques in this slightly new (to me) version of sugar dating. Thanks in advance...

Btw, I'm more interested in a novel/unconventional experience and connection than simply a sexual encounter. I can reasonably easily afford to purchase more of the latter than I have time or (at my age) physical capacity to enjoy. The former, however, are far more precious and difficult to find.

-Ww

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Awesome, sounds like you're in the right frame of mind for this game Most of the comments on cost or lack of guarantees seem to be missing the point IMHO. I see UC as providing a well-curated selection of girls who are looking for a good time but nothing serious. Sure, you can find those girls at a bar if you get lucky but man is it random and a lot of work! Much more effective to be able to browse profiles, choose the ones you find attractive, and then get a little impression of their personality from the video and description.

I don't believe guys have a profile at UC that the girls can access. They don't take a photo or anything but do ask your approximate age, profession, income, etc for internal use. Right now the staff manually relays your request to the girls via email, I suspect they do give a brief and flattering description of you though

As far as making a choice goes, each girl has profile basic info, around 3 photos and a video (sometimes two, one speaking English and the other Japanese). The photos are either touched up a bit or just really well done as quite a few girls don't look as good in their video, but many look the same or better. There's also a comments section where the staff describes the girl a bit, seems pretty honest and sometimes quite funny.

As I mentioned before the videos are really useful in gauging a girl's personality, you can tell how outgoing or shy she is, how she handles eye contact, whether she just reads the prompted text, etc. The other major factors are the amount she expects if you end up at a hotel and a "dating types" system that describes (1) whether they're only open for dinner at first, (2) open to more with the right chemistry, (3) generally open to more, and (4) willing to meet more than once or engage in a relationship. From a brief survey most girls are marked 1,2,4 with many/most 3 as well.

So I'd say between the staff comment, video, amount expected and dating types you can get a pretty good idea of the girl's personality and what she's looking for. Then it's just a matter of trying to find a mutually agreeable meeting time.

I haven't been on a date yet, but I've had some great discussions with the UC staff and the best approach seems to simply treat the first date as a normal date with a girl you want to impress. Make a reservation somewhere nice, have some great conversation over food & drink, and if there's any chemistry (and the girl isn't a dinner-date only type) then move on to a hotel somewhere (I've been told love hotels are perfectly fine, just go somewhere nice). If there's no chemistry or the timing is off then send her home with a thank you and token payment, and you can meet again or not.

Full disclosure: I've signed up with UC as a gold member but won't have my first date till next week. The platinum girls are very attractive and I'd recommend using your trial setting to date one, but I do get the impression that they're high-maintenance and more in it for the money than fun.

Also note that there are at least two known professional girls on UC, which makes me wonder how many others might also be escorts.

Serenity Now said:

For restaurants I have ranged from Y12,000 to Y30,000. The more expensive have been for follow up dates when I had a good connection with a girl. I can see this being criticized but it is my choice.

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That definitely sounds like the right choice to me! A first date somewhere really fancy is pretty risky whether with someone you found on UC or met at a wedding. Sure it might impress the gold-digger type but if there's no chemistry a nicer girl might be quite uncomfortable. Somewhere classy but still reasonably casual is the best choice all around.

Of course there'd be nothing wrong with choosing one of the really high-end platinum or black girls and in that case perhaps a very fancy dinner will add to the excitement later

Serenity Now said:

Also with you on this being more than just the after dinner fun. I have spent the afternoon and evening with girls on follow up dates, 8 hours plus, and it has been a lot of fun.

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This!

Wonderfully helpful info. Thanks very much, guys!

-Ww

So I went on my first date today, overall a very nice experience! Not having to watch a clock and being able to chat & drink/eat/whatever prior to hitting a hotel is really pleasant and improved the experience a lot for me, though I suppose it makes chemistry more important than your typical escort experience. I consider the girl I met way more attractive than any of the AM girls and we spent ~5h together for Y40k (not counting setting fee of course) + drinks, hotel, etc. Hotel time was also much better than my pro experiences, much more what I'd expect a real GFE to be! She was very fun, very eager, and while certainly no PSE a very good time.

Definitely got the impression she wasn't new to this game though, the script followed what you'd expect from AM or a Japanese independent to a T. Not a bad thing, better than my previous experiences in every way, but really didn't feel like a sugar baby experience... perhaps should have expected that given that she was categorized as basically a guaranteed ending Like I said, very nice and no regrets, but next time I'm definitely picking someone who looks like more of a challenge.

drewz said:

next time I'm definitely picking someone who looks like more of a challenge.

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Imo, that last comment (above) in your helpful post captures one of the most important ways in which the sugar bowl is different from the conventional escort scene and, for many of us, better (worth more).

In any case, two further questions - When you say that your date "was categorized as basically a guaranteed ending", do you mean that the UC profiles of the women/SBs indicates that some of them do and some of them do not "guarantee" some sort of satisfaction in the hotel room at the end of the date? If so, roughly what fraction of them do indicate their commitment to such an "ending". Is it the norm or an exception?

-Ww

The girls do list there willingness to continue the date via some predefined categories.

I would say the minority are in the 'guaranteed ending' category.

However most are open to it but use the 'based on compatibility' clause if I can put it that way.

I have dated both types and it has never been an issue to move from dinner to the hotel. I guess it just gives them an out if they really do not feel comfortable with the guy.

And there are a few who just state an interest in dinner but this has been more at the Standard level.

And I would say that the girls who do not necessarily guarantee the ending have been the more enjoyable dates.

Wwanderer said:

Imo, that last comment (above) in your helpful post captures one of the most important ways in which the sugar bowl is different from the conventional escort scene and, for many of us, better (worth more).

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I definitely agree! A good sugar experience should be very much a date that just happens to include compensation. I.e. unscripted and none of that fake vocalization which I find rather disagreeable.

Wwanderer said:

In any case, two further questions - When you say that your date "was categorized as basically a guaranteed ending", do you mean that the UC profiles of the women/SBs indicates that some of them do and some of them do not "guarantee" some sort of satisfaction in the hotel room at the end of the date? If so, roughly what fraction of them do indicate their commitment to such an "ending". Is it the norm or an exception?

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The way it was explained to me is that there's never a guarantee, but yes they're categorized according to how open they are to ending up at a hotel. A small number are categorized as (1) only interested in dinner on a first date, perhaps 10% (very rough guess) are (2) open to a hotel if the chemistry is right, and probably 90% are (3) generally open and expecting an invitation. The final category (4) is whether they're open to repeat dates, so far haven't seen anyone who isn't.

The categories are combined, so most girls are listed in all four, but the 10% lack category 3.

Of course the girls understand the system and only get a token "taxi" payment if the date ends at dinner. Not quite sure how that works with the ones classified as dinner only, but I'm sure the staff would explain. There is at least one high-end model type who expects a good sum even just for dinner, and that's listed in the freeform notes, but appears to be rare.

Ya gotta love market transparency!

-Ww

Well dear TAG friends, it appears I've discovered the error of my ways! A certain subset of UC ladies are not categorized as interested in dinner dates. This does not mean they will not join you for dinner, or will not be pleasant dining companions, rather it means that they have firm expectations of continuing at a hotel afterwards. This may be a handy method of finding an independent playmate for those so inclined, something that seems rather difficult in Tokyo. As for your humble correspondent and guinea pig, I shall stick with the dinner date category and take my chances!

Thanks for the update I was also unaware of this interpretation when this was omitted.

SN.

drewz said:

Well dear TAG friends, it appears I've discovered the error of my ways! A certain subset of UC ladies are not categorized as interested in dinner dates. This does not mean they will not join you for dinner, or will not be pleasant dining companions, rather it means that they have firm expectations of continuing at a hotel afterwards. This may be a handy method of finding an independent playmate for those so inclined, something that seems rather difficult in Tokyo. As for your humble correspondent and guinea pig, I shall stick with the dinner date category and take my chances!

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And these women identify themselves how? Maybe they list category 3 and 4 but not 1 or 2?

In any case, thanks for the additional valuable information!

-Ww

Correct, they would be 2 3 4 or just 3 4.

Guess the '4' is not required either, just indicates if they are willing to remain in contact after the date.

Have only seen a few girls that omitted the 4.

SN

Serenity Now said:

Correct, they would be 2 3 4 or just 3 4.

Guess the '4' is not required either, just indicates if they are willing to remain in contact after the date.

Have only seen a few girls that omitted the 4.

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Yeah, the "4" hardly makes sense. I can't see why anyone, the SB or the SD, would either want to promise to stay in contact (and meet again) or promise not to stay in contact (and meet again). WTF basically.

-Ww

Wwanderer said:

Yeah, the "4" hardly makes sense. I can't see why anyone, the SB or the SD, would either want to promise to stay in contact (and meet again) or promise not to stay in contact (and meet again). WTF basically.

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This piqued my interest and I was guessing that perhaps some of the AV actresses or gravure models don't want to be seen with the same guy too frequently...

Boy was I wrong! Based on a quick sampling it seems like all of the girls lacking category 4 are 1 or 1,2 meaning dinner only, or dinner only but a small chance for more given chemistry and timing.

I don't know how to interpret that, other than to assume they'll only go on one dinner date with someone unless there's a great connection. No idea why you'd pick one of them, the sample set was generally quite young but not very attractive.

drewz said:

This piqued my interest and I was guessing that perhaps some of the AV actresses or gravure models don't want to be seen with the same guy too frequently...

Boy was I wrong! Based on a quick sampling it seems like all of the girls lacking category 4 are 1 or 1,2 meaning dinner only, or dinner only but a small chance for more given chemistry and timing.

I don't know how to interpret that, other than to assume they'll only go on one dinner date with someone unless there's a great connection. No idea why you'd pick one of them, the sample set was generally quite young but not very attractive.

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Ahhhh...that actually begins to make some sense to me. My speculation is that these are women who want to make whatever money they can off the UC thing *without* ever having sex with some stranger who picked them off a web page etc. It surely greatly limits their earnings, but I guess they still get something plus some nice meals (or at least that is their goal). My guess is that such an "SBs" (the term doesn't actually apply to them imo) figures that the expectation of and pressure for going back to the hotel will only grow with subsequent dates, so they want to avoid them.

Ads on SA (SeekingArrangement) from women clearly stating "no sex ever" but offering to be your "arm candy" and "friend" in return for an allowance of a thousand or a few per month are not too uncommon, though surely totally unrealistic. Maybe "no 4" women at UC are the analogy of those SA "no sex ever" women.

-Ww

Actually 4 would not be relevant to 'no sex', 4 is just for further contact.

The UC for 'no sex' would be 1 4 or just 1. The 2 & 3 are the 'key' numbers...