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First experience on Paddy, got fooled like the rookie I am

gramm87

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So I went to deliheru and soap a few times, and I'm kind of tired of finding what/who is gaijin-ok or not depending on the mood of the clerk, who will FS or not, or scrutinizing measurement to sort out the fatties and getting crooked-back girls instead. Yes, maybe I should go to more expensive places, I know I know.

But after reading that post from that other(s) guy(s) I decided to give a try to the Paddy app. After just creating an account with a nice picture of me in a suit I started getting dozens of likes (I'm at 130 now apparently, not that it matters much; maybe a guy having time for actual dating and chatting would have fun though). After some embarrassing chats I fixed my description using the magic keywords (大人の関係), made some more embarrassing chats, then discovered the "plan date" menu where girls are listed by the available time. I guess this is where most of the sugar arrangements happen, with many girls having status updates in the like of "hayaku issho ni asobitai". I made myself a pretty straightforward message template (hajimemashite, I'm looking for otona kankei, how about we have ocha and if the feelingu is aeba we continue to a hotel, thanks bro whoever wrote those magic words on the other thread) and sent a few messages to cute girls, with a good response rate (I think honestly 75%). On the other side, the keywords seem to be "I'm also looking for otona" and "what are your 手本 (pattern ie what you want to do) and 条件 (conditions how long/how much I guess).

Now being the horny dog I an and being all excited of doing the arrangement directly myself, I managed an appointo in the afternoon with a nice "rock style" girl with 3man for 2 hours (I guess too expensive, but I'm horny). So we meet at Ikebukuro, as usual I talk quite a lot, we go to the hotel, I like the girl style and body (yayapochi with wide hips and fat thighs), I gave her 3man, shower and do it but she's clearly not really into it, then we shower again... And then while I'm trying to play music on the stupid sound system she's getting dressed (it's been one hour). When I notice I say "mou ikkai asobou yo" and she goes that it was actually painful (I'm big so it might be true) and it would be weird if she had to force herself... So now we're suddenly in a weird situation where she keeps talking (she's finish dressing now) about hokkaido and the yachin and going to yakiniku and I'm there naked in the bed, completely drowsy due to post-coital relaxation as well as having being woken up at 5 am by a fucking crow, thinking that my options are either to go ahead and force myself on the girl somehow - something that doesn't really appeals to me even though that's what I was doing 15 minutes before - or to go ahead and ask for my money back to a girl that has been playing me like a fiddle, with the big question of what if she says no (will I find the will to fight the girl? or will I once again stfu like the loser I am?).

As I am pondering these questions about the nature of my own loosiness she manages to make her way out pretending a phone call, and 10 minutes later I am making my way through the damp streets of Ikebukuro. Looking at my phone in the metro, she already deleted her account.

Somehow I'm pissed about half of the 3man, but I also kind of enjoy the whole introspection and experience.

Anyway! Thought I'd share this because maybe people tend not to share the bad stories. I will cancel my other arrangement I had this week (same conditions) and go with stricter 条件 - maybe 1man/hour paid by the hour or something. Any tips / help is welcome!
 
Thanks for sharing your experience. Believe me, it has happened to pretty much all of us at one time or another. Just put it down to a learning experience and move on.
Like P4P, there is also a great range in the sugar bowl. At one end of the spectrum you have what is basically P4P under a different name, and at the other end you have something closer to a proper relationship with a bit of support involved.
I think your first job is decide where you fit in.

From reading the above it seems to me you are just looking for girls to bang. By being so blatant about what you are after will attract women looking for the same thing (sex for cash), and therefore you'll get girls who look at it as a job (i.e. pros), who try to make the most money with the least effort. After all, 3 man for 2 hours is more than a decent deri.

Any tips / help is welcome!
My advice to you would be (and this is just what works for me, and I'm sure others on here can give you better advice than I can). And I'm assuming you are looking for regular girls rather than pros.

1. Soften your approach. Don't just go direct with the 大人関係 approach. Try something like いきなり大人関係じゃなく… and then when you get to the 条件 say something like 食事.5 食事と大人3. IMHE this approach works as it gives the female a mental out (she does not feel like a pro). And in almost all cases you generally do OK on the first date.
2. I also think (given what you describe above), paying in advance was a mistake. I would have kept the payment until the end. If she didn't meet the 条件 then you are well within your rights to lessen the payment. You had an agreed time and amount, and if she wanted to leave early then I think it's fine to deduct a small amount. I'd only do this if it was a clear violation of your agreement (i.e. time) and not that you just didn't enjoy the time in bed.
3. I'd also not beat yourself up about this. You have great experiences and shit one in p4p. The same is most definitely true of the sugar world as well. It takes a while to find the right SB, but when you do it is great fun.
 
I am a heavy Paddy user. I get anywhere from 5-20 new messages a day to meet up.

Paddy can be rough. I had an incident happen with a girl from Paddy in Kabukicho. Almost to the point of physical violence. Then, there are the super girls who you love to pay for play, oh sugar dating.

The key with Paddy, and might as well throw in PJ and Sugardaddy is to filter them up front. One girl I met actually schooled me in saying you need to ask what you want, explicitly up front. I thought I was doing that with asking about skilled blowjobs and cum swallowing and sex with out condoms but she went into more detail and I was amazed.

What I do, and you can do the same is to ask this on the first message volleys. いきなりにすみませんが、お手当の話をしましょう。お手当は決まっていませんが、普段はお茶1、大人2−3になります。よろしいでしょうか? This will weed out the money grubbers and time wasters. Also, NEVER EVER offer meals, so no lunch or no dinner. You want to get them into the coffee shop then to the hotel with minimal cash expenses. There is a time window that I have learned that you can actually hurt your chances by shooting the shot, as us sales guys say.

Also, this is extra info but get alcohol before you meet the girl. Not the super heavy kind but some beers or light cocktail type of stuff. Not alot but something to grease the wheels. Get a disposable razor, extra panty from the conbini for mochi kaeri sniffing. I have met some cutie girls with a bush and it is nuts. The razor is your friend here. Don't bring scissors as that is creepy as hell. LOL. I think I posted this somewhere, maybe not here but never ever take a bag that has a strap (re: kabukicho bitch), and always put your wallet, car keys, important suff into a locker before meeting the girl. Bring the right amount of cash and a little bit more for shits and giggles and enjoy.
 
Thanks for sharing your experience. Believe me, it has happened to pretty much all of us at one time or another. Just put it down to a learning experience and move on.
Like P4P, there is also a great range in the sugar bowl. At one end of the spectrum you have what is basically P4P under a different name, and at the other end you have something closer to a proper relationship with a bit of support involved.
I think your first job is decide where you fit in.

From reading the above it seems to me you are just looking for girls to bang. By being so blatant about what you are after will attract women looking for the same thing (sex for cash), and therefore you'll get girls who look at it as a job (i.e. pros), who try to make the most money with the least effort. After all, 3 man for 2 hours is more than a decent deri.


My advice to you would be (and this is just what works for me, and I'm sure others on here can give you better advice than I can). And I'm assuming you are looking for regular girls rather than pros.

1. Soften your approach. Don't just go direct with the 大人関係 approach. Try something like いきなり大人関係じゃなく… and then when you get to the 条件 say something like 食事.5 食事と大人3. IMHE this approach works as it gives the female a mental out (she does not feel like a pro). And in almost all cases you generally do OK on the first date.
2. I also think (given what you describe above), paying in advance was a mistake. I would have kept the payment until the end. If she didn't meet the 条件 then you are well within your rights to lessen the payment. You had an agreed time and amount, and if she wanted to leave early then I think it's fine to deduct a small amount. I'd only do this if it was a clear violation of your agreement (i.e. time) and not that you just didn't enjoy the time in bed.
3. I'd also not beat yourself up about this. You have great experiences and shit one in p4p. The same is most definitely true of the sugar world as well. It takes a while to find the right SB, but when you do it is great fun.

Good advice. I would not offer 食事. That is for the 3rd date and beyond. My last sugar MILF loved 朝マック and dominos pizza, or even rotisserie chicken from Costco. My experience is not to do the shokuji on the first date. Push them for a cheapie coffee meeting and go from there. Strategically position the coffee place near love hotels for the quick move. If they balk, just walk away without giving them any money. If they claim Police station or yakuza, they have no standing on that.

Sugar dating is a business, it is the more formalized version of p4p. Don't let the young girlies fool you on that. I have seen the banter on twitter where they are laughing at the guys who don't understand this. They post your profile pics and chat, I see it all the time - mostly Japanese guys though.
 
Sorry, should have written this too. Look up hash tags on twitter for パパ活 or Paters or whatever, you will see this crap.
 
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@gramm87
You can see that @shammykun and I have quite different styles.
Mine works for me and I presume his works for him.

Our goals are quite different ( I prefer to cultivate long term SBs and when i find some I like I stick with them.)
If I'm traveling and it is clear that it is gonna be a one time thing then the more direct approach works better for me, but if it's a steady, long term thing you're after then the softer approach, while time consuming, gets me the kind of girls I want.
It took me about 20 dates with different girls to get on to my current 2 SBs (and I have a SF on the side too).
 
I wouldn't say you're a fool. It wasn't such bad situation. You could pay 3man for an escort and get similar low satisfaction. I'm not meaning to disrespect your experience, just suggesting you don't worry too much about it
 
It's worth noting that both parties are vulnerable so paying up front from the girl's pov is to prevent dudes doing a runner after the deed. Works both ways so taking it slow and clear communication is probably the best approach.
 
Am I the only one who feels the need to post a reminder that forcing yourself on someone is rape?
Nope, you aren’t. And it’s also worth a reminder that even if you paid for time with the expectation of sex, if the girl (or boy) has had a change of heart and aren’t into carrying through, it’s still rape. At most you should negotiate a refund.
 
Am I the only one who feels the need to post a reminder that forcing yourself on someone is rape?
Which is exactly what I mean, the first time it was consensual (no matter if she enjoyed it or not), the second time it would clearly have not. Which is why the option was a no-go for me.

Anyway thanks for the answers guys it's really helpful. kandou shimasu. We're just chatting on a forum but it's my actual life right here, so thanks really.
I don't know what I'm after, I have a lifetime of frustration behind me and now that I got a drop of the p4p world I want to try it all. I like the idea of going for a drink instead of shokuji, first of all because I'm all sleepy and farty after lunch, and lunch sounds like a bigger time/money investment. I guess cake-time would be a good compromise. I like chatting with the girls and if possible I'd like having some regular girls instead of random girls each time. So the comments about filtering out the pros are really helpful.
Next week I guess I'll give another try, with mandatory ocha-date.

PS not that depressed by my experience, just sobered up lol. Also thanks for the tips about leaving everything at home, this is what I did already for this date following the other post recommendation.
 
Nope, you aren’t. And it’s also worth a reminder that even if you paid for time with the expectation of sex, if the girl (or boy) has had a change of heart and aren’t into carrying through, it’s still rape. At most you should negotiate a refund.
Jeezuz abuser? You are here too?

Would you just stop posting? You have no idea what goes on in the sugar world as you are what, like 10 years old?

I ask the admin to monitor your posts as it is non productive.
 
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I ask the admin to monitor your posts as it is non productive.
We all have different set of opinions, but @Sudsy is a long-time, senior member here with a significant amount of contribution.
I'd like you both to step back, cool off and either get along or put each other on ignore.
 
Which is exactly what I mean, the first time it was consensual (no matter if she enjoyed it or not), the second time it would clearly have not. Which is why the option was a no-go for me.

Anyway thanks for the answers guys it's really helpful. kandou shimasu. We're just chatting on a forum but it's my actual life right here, so thanks really.
I don't know what I'm after, I have a lifetime of frustration behind me and now that I got a drop of the p4p world I want to try it all. I like the idea of going for a drink instead of shokuji, first of all because I'm all sleepy and farty after lunch, and lunch sounds like a bigger time/money investment. I guess cake-time would be a good compromise. I like chatting with the girls and if possible I'd like having some regular girls instead of random girls each time. So the comments about filtering out the pros are really helpful.
Next week I guess I'll give another try, with mandatory ocha-date.

PS not that depressed by my experience, just sobered up lol. Also thanks for the tips about leaving everything at home, this is what I did already for this date following the other post recommendation.

Don't give up on sugar dating. Depending on your budget and time allowance, it can be amazing. Keep trying, it takes time to find the right sugar baby.
 
We all have different set of opinions, but @Sudsy is a long-time, senior member here with a significant amount of contribution.
I'd like you both to step back, cool off and either get along or put each other on ignore.
Understood and sorry to shake the boat. Just when someone wants to sledgehammer someone, it is a bit abusive.
 
Just when someone wants to sledgehammer someone, it is a bit abusive.
So is twisting someone's ears.....enjoy your time here plzzz
 
C'mon guys no fighting in my thread, unless it involves mud and/or food.

One question for the incorrigible I am... If you do ocha with a SB for .5 or 1., are you still supposed to pay the whole bill? :D
 
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C'mon guys no fighting in my thread, unless it involves mud and/or food.

One question for the incorrigible I am... If you do ocha with a SB for .5 or 1., are you still supposed to pay the whole bill? :D

Depends what you "negotiated". If you didn't discuss it in advance, then the reasonable expectation is that you would pay the fee plus expenses.

You can imagine the quality of women you would be meeting if you "successfully" negotiated .5/1 less the cost of the frappuccino and cinnamon roll.
 
dumb question; are SB sites anonymous? do guys have to post full face pics?

I signed up and seems like I can't even search for guys so it's "safe" unless the site gets hacked.
 
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dumb question; are SB sites anonymous? do guys have to post full face pics?

I signed up and seems like I can't even search for guys so it's "safe" unless the site gets hacked.

I don’t think any require you to post a full face pic (although many will tell you it will increase your odds - I never have and never will, so I can’t tell you if that’s true or not).

Some, such as Paters, require you to send an unredacted photo of your photo ID for age verification purposes - you can’t message unless you do so. That doesn’t get posted, but it’s also not clear how long they keep the data.

For sugar daddy, they will take your ability to pay by credit card as proof that you are over 18, and don’t require a copy of your ID. But that also means you won’t get the 本人確認 badge. I’ve had some girls say they aren’t interested since I don’t have the badge, but honestly I do well enough without it that I can’t imagine sending sugar daddy a copy of my ID with my full name and address. (Similarly, I wouldn’t ever send a copy of my tax return to prove my income. Some girls say they won’t message anyone without the income proven badge, but I’ve never felt the need to get it.)
 
Also, you wouldn’t be able to search for men if you are signed up as a man. Even if the site isn’t “hacked”, someone with a female profile could easily screenshot or save your photo. (There is a website that trawls girls’ profiles on sugar daddy doing just that - that’s a shit thing to do but I would not be surprised if there are people doing the same for men’s profiles.)
 
About this お茶1,大人2-3 lingo

You guys are paying 1 man just to get tea? Or does that mean you have to pay for the drinks/food and on top of that 1man?
 
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is it common for so many women to not have any pictures? i'm just assuming they are bots