Learning Kanji

[Acid Burn]

A lot of academic weeaboos like to sit there and drill bare kanji, then they crush every test, but can't read or speak. But to me it's pointless to study bare kanji.

Academic weeaboo, such a good description. I’m going to start using that term now. 😂

I’m not so sure about the can’t read bit though. Maybe for the Chinese ones who kanji their way through the JLPT’s. I think a lot of the western academic weeaboo types love their manga and visual novels though. At least the ones on Reddit. Haha.

 

[bdole]

Has anyone used Renshuu? It seems to hit all the major areas (kanji, grammar, reading/speaking) in a highly customizable way, but I don't know enough to know if it's a useful setup and method.

 

[Chorizo]

I’ll check out this renshuu thing soon, I like the way wanikani works so far but I agree the words they feed me don’t seem to be optimized for conversational Japanese.

I started duolingo as well and am looking to add other tools as well,

Can anyone recommend something that focuses on specifically ENG to Japanese stuff? What I notice with wanikani and other stuff I’m using is that it’s mostly Japanese to Eng and I find myself recognizing the kanji or the words but when I try the other way around to think how would I translate that word from Eng, I cannot do it that well.

Once again, thanks all for the comments!

 

[requiemmorrow]

Has anyone used Renshuu? It seems to hit all the major areas (kanji, grammar, reading/speaking) in a highly customizable way, but I don't know enough to know if it's a useful setup and method.

I used Renshuu for 3 years.
I’m convinced it helped me gain a whole JLPT level. To use it effectively though you have to hustle and study with self-discipline—not a way that works for everyone.

I don’t say much about Wanikani other than that it didn’t work for me, but to each their own.

 

[bdole]

To use it effectively though you have to hustle and study with self-discipline—not a way that works for everyone.

How did you use it? Like, daily lessons for X minutes?

 

[fireman]

I really like the KanjiBox flashcard app.

 

[bdole]

Has anyone used Renshuu? It seems to hit all the major areas (kanji, grammar, reading/speaking) in a highly customizable way, but I don't know enough to know if it's a useful setup and method.

It was on sale and Google gave me a coupon, so I went ahead and bought the lifetime pro for Renshuu. Coming from the overly simplistic DuoLingo, I'm liking the depth and customizability in Renshuu so far. Time will tell if it's an effective learning tool, but I think it will work well for me for now.

 

[Chorizo]

I looked at it briefly but I think I prefer being asked to write the answer down rather than selecting from a multiple choice set. Multiple choice feels like cheating.

 

[Alice]

I looked at it briefly but I think I prefer being asked to write the answer down rather than selecting from a multiple choice set. Multiple choice feels like cheating.

I mean, JLPT is all multiple choice, lol.
As long as you can recognize a kanji you can basically get by even with typing.

 

[bdole]

I looked at it briefly but I think I prefer being asked to write the answer down rather than selecting from a multiple choice set. Multiple choice feels like cheating.

It has options to require writing the answer, even for kanji questions. You can disable multiple choice completely if you want.

 

[Chorizo]

I mean, JLPT is all multiple choice, lol.
As long as you can recognize a kanji you can basically get by even with typing.

Well that’s the problem, I don’t recognize some of the kanji or the words, but I can infer what the correct answer is by eliminating the other wrong answers which I know. That is why MC feels like cheating. And yea, I don’t care about tests, I genuinely want to learn not pass a stupid test.

It has options to require writing the answer, even for kanji questions. You can disable multiple choice completely if you want.

Did not know that, thanks for letting me know. I’ll look at the settings a bit more carefully.

 

[bdole]

Did not know that, thanks for letting me know. I’ll look at the settings a bit more carefully.

It's not all of them, but a bunch of different schedules have different settings, and you can turn on "write answers where possible" or something like that, and some let you deselect "multiple choice" questions.

 

[Ken Obi]

1. kanji is essential - how you learn it varies, but it impoves your vocab which you use in speaking
2. read fuzoku girls' diaries. You'll see about 200 or so kanji used over and over, copy/paste phrases into you fav dictionary
3. find a Japanese guy forum. copy/paste.

I killed like 3 birds with this one stone: I'm interested in the girls, so it keeps me motivated; I learn new words and phrases for general knowledge; and since I'm learning more about Japanese girls, it really helps in conversation. However, since I mostly hangout with soap, deli, and kyaba girls, I realized I know more sexual terms than is healthy ...

Unless you have Japanese people who will patiently teach you new words through speech... you need to learn to read - which involves learning Kanji.

 

[Alice]

I realized I know more sexual terms than is healthy ...

No such thing.

Unless you have Japanese people who will patiently teach you new words through speech...

That’s how I learned more sexual terms than is healthy.

 

[Maxblack]

Read Japanese porn and when it makes you hard, you’re fluent.

 

[Ken4fb]

Read Japanese porn and when it makes you hard, you’re fluent.

Solid advice , pun fully intended.

 

[goodguyjean]

A bit late, but on your point of the various Kanji readings - not a WaniKani issue. The language is just built in such a way that you can become super proficient (even native) and there are some combinations/strange readings that are just so obscure that people will either not know them or frequently read them incorrectly.

Imagine explaining to an English learner that you aren't actually going to eat a horse because we use "literally" when we mean to say "figuratively", i.e. "I'm so hungry, I could literally eat a horse." and many other such examples. There's an aspect to learning languages that is especially prevalent when picking up Kanji: you need to numb the inquisitive side of your brain for the first year and just accept whatever it tells you. You can figure out the nuance once you have a stable foundation.

On that note, I believe the best format is whatever you're able to consistently stick with: Anki? WaniKani? pen and paper? You might invest varying amounts of time or resources (read : dollars) into each, but they can all be effective if you adapt them to your learning style and create a process that allows you to consistently progress. I've met people who have used all of the above individually, combined, or in entirely different ways, and they have all met their goals. It's about finding what works for you.

I'd spend a good couple of days not worrying about actually studying and seriously considering what the progression will look like for each of your options and whether you feel like you can snowball it into a habit that will get you where you want to go. I have switched between services that are practically identical for reasons as simple as somewhat preferring one's UI/UX, despite a significantly steeper subscription fee. I say all of this knowing that internalizing such things can help you overcome that initial hurdle which keeps many from snowballing.

Best of luck!

 

[Chorizo]

Yea, I get that for sure. I guess my gripe with it at the time was that maybe they should’ve first gave me some more words that reinforced one reading before they fed me another. When you’re being fed 4 different readings all within such a short timeframe it gets messed up and confusing. After almost 4 weeks now, I just finished the 3 free levels and I can say that some things did start to make more sense. Not sure whether I’m gonna pay 300 bucks for it tho to be able to continue with a lifetime membership.

I also spent more time on renshuu and I’m starting to like it. I think I still prefer wanikani for kanji alone, but renshuu has grammar and sentencing and lots more than just kanji. It also feels like you can use it as a freeware for longer than just 3 levels.

I think I could see myself using both in a complementary fashion long term. I’ll see if they run any specials in the near future and may buy both lifetime subscriptions.

 

[goodguyjean]

Yea, I get that for sure. I guess my gripe with it at the time was that maybe they should’ve first gave me some more words that reinforced one reading before they fed me another. When you’re being fed 4 different readings all within such a short timeframe it gets messed up and confusing. After almost 4 weeks now, I just finished the 3 free levels and I can say that some things did start to make more sense. Not sure whether I’m gonna pay 300 bucks for it tho to be able to continue with a lifetime membership.

I also spent more time on renshuu and I’m starting to like it. I think I still prefer wanikani for kanji alone, but renshuu has grammar and sentencing and lots more than just kanji. It also feels like you can use it as a freeware for longer than just 3 levels.

I think I could see myself using both in a complementary fashion long term. I’ll see if they run any specials in the near future and may buy both lifetime subscriptions.

WaniKani tends to run a -%50 lifetime sale around New Years and they used to (still might) retroactively discount the total cost at that time proportional to the amount of months you held a monthly membership. Example: you register now and pay for three months through the end of December ($9/month) and buy the lifetime in January, they will take $27 off the cost of lifetime for you on top of the % discount!

This was their m.o. a few years back so be sure to do some more up to date research before putting your card down, but I'm willing to bet that they have something similar ongoing.

 

[Tabanico]

I like the heisig approach tomkanji because for me it sort of solved the different readings. Like, instead of learning that 人 can be read eg. Hito, jin, non, etc. I just learnt the various compounds that have that character in them. If that makes sense?

 

[Acid Burn]

Not sure whether I’m gonna pay 300 bucks for it tho to be able to continue with a lifetime membership.

Wait until Xmas time for WaniKani. Last year their xmas sale was $100 off the lifetime price.

WaniKani tends to run a -%50 lifetime sale around New Years and they used to (still might) retroactively discount the total cost at that time proportional to the amount of months you held a monthly membership.

I was not discounted for the few months I had monthly before upgrading last year.

 

[DuttyDan]

Yeah, at least if you do nothing else in those 12 years. And then that makes you barely able to read.

Japanese kids study kanji daily until end of high school. That is 12 years of studying kanji. And they are native which of course immersively helps.

It honestly stuns me that, for how advanced and efficient of a society that Japan has, they have such a complex written language.

You'd think that they'd take moreso from the English language and just make shit simple: No conjugation, very tiny alphabet, etc.

And it honestly amuses me that even with their complex language, Koreans still speak much better English [on average] than Japanese people.

 

[Maxblack]

Korea and Japan inherited alot from China; kanji, hanko, etc. Most of it Korea dropped for modern reasons and Japan kept. 🤔

 

[SugoiBoy]

Korea and Japan inherited alot from China; kanji, hanko, etc. Most of it Korea dropped for modern reasons and Japan kept. 🤔

Most Hanja (Sino-Korean characters) only have one reading/pronunciation. So, that made it fairly easy to simply write them out phonetically in Hangul (Korean alphabet).

Korean has fewer homonyms than Japanese. Also, Korean has far more sounds than Japanese.

Although South Korean children learn Hanja in school, they rarely use them in daily life. Almost everything is in Hangul only.

 

[Chorizo]

I mean, to be fair, Japan could do the same and just write everything in hiragana. It’s not like when people speak to each other, they magically see the kanji…they only hear the sounds and understand. So they could also understand reading in hiragana only, without needing kanji and katakana, no? Sure if you simply want to write down single words, that may pose a problem if you’re dealing with homonyms, but for everything else people can figure it out from the context.