Letter from the immigration office?

[warubuta]

Perhaps, I will fail but all people fail at different things in their lives. Let's hear about your most recent fail?

There is still a chance I could obtain permanent residence. Remember all those people that were so sure President Trump wouldn't become President?

You don't want to end up with egg on your face do you?

You might get it. I hope you do. But the holy trinity of PR is taxes, pension and national health insurance. I thought all along you were signed up and paid up. Shit man. I do hope you get it. Really. My biggest recent fail? So many to choose from. Let me think about it.

 

[TokyoJoeblow]

You might get it. I hope you do. But the holy trinity of PR is taxes, pension and national health insurance. I thought all along you were signed up and paid up. Shit man. I do hope you get it. Really. My biggest recent fail? So many to choose from. Let me think about it.

Hold up, how is pension of of the 3 corners of the holy trinity of PR?

This trinity must have been recently forged because I know foreigners that have PR that didn't even sign up for the national pension system...but then again, all these guys applied for PR years/decades ago.

The "I fail" comment seemed out of place considering all of your other recent posts on my threads have been friendly...or at least seem friendly lol.

Sudsy hasn't heard anything about this and from what I gather from his posts, he works in a field that relates to a lot of this type stuff.

Maybe I'm going to be the first foreigner to feel this new corner of the trinity...more like a triforce...going right up my ass.

 

[LeonGRAY]

I dont know anyone who used a lawyer. Most people I know, provided proof of marriage (usually this is the koseki tohon) proof of employment (usually a letter from your company, brochure etc.) and proof that you have paid employment and residency taxes for however long you have been here. One of the key elements is to show that you are married. Go with your wife. Hold hands. Let her ask them what else you need to provide. If you go with a lawyer, then they might wonder what is so complicated about your situation that a lawyer is required. I am sure others will have a different opinion.

Exactly. Would raise a red flag for sure. Go with the wife and pretend to be naive and smile.

 

[warubuta]

Hold up, how is pension of of the 3 corners of the holy trinity of PR?

This trinity must have been recently forged because I know foreigners that have PR that didn't even sign up for the national pension system...but then again, all these guys applied for PR years/decades ago.

The "I fail" comment seemed out of place considering all of your other recent posts on my threads have been friendly...or at least seem friendly lol.

Sudsy hasn't heard anything about this and from what I gather from his posts, he works in a field that relates to a lot of this type stuff.

Maybe I'm going to be the first foreigner to feel this new corner of the trinity...more like a triforce...going right up my ass.

I thought you were at least enrolled. I guess if you and your wife have a reason to be exempt then it wouldn’t be a deal breaker, but you can see from a logical perspective how it would be a red flag. It is, no matter how you look at it kind of a fail. If you don’t get PR this round, you need to get enrolled in the trinity and start to make some kind of payments. Think of it like you are Michael Corleone and you are trying to make the Family enterprise legit.

 

[Frenchy]

The funny thing is that I’m sure TJB hates the foreigners in his own country who just want to benefit from the system and not contribute to it.

 

[TokyoJoeblow]

I thought you were at least enrolled. I guess if you and your wife have a reason to be exempt then it wouldn’t be a deal breaker, but you can see from a logical perspective how it would be a red flag. It is, no matter how you look at it kind of a fail. If you don’t get PR this round, you need to get enrolled in the trinity and start to make some kind of payments. Think of it like you are Michael Corleone and you are trying to make the Family enterprise legit.

Well, we are both enrolled and have been for over 2 years. I was making payments on both of our pension accounts before, but I'm just not earning enough money to afford all this shit.

What makes the situation more annoying is the Japanese man I spoke with on the phone sounded so polite and friendly mentioning how it is OK if I quit one of my part time jobs during the PR application process and that I don't need to look for another job. Then I get this letter requesting not just my pension status but specifically "proof of payment" of my pension and my wife's pension.

If they aren't cool with both pensions being "exempt" then I'm going to then ask why he said I don't need to find another job if him and the rest of the immigration staff are going to contradict such a statement by asking for proof that I paid for shit that I can't afford without the job they said I don't need...for fuck sake lol.

 

[warubuta]

Don’t you see how absurd it is for you to think that Local tax, National tax, National Health, Pension and Immigration would all actually bother to talk to each other about your application for PR? Do you think the world is made to serve you? They will not talk to each other about you or about anything else. And they will always give you conflicting advice. The question is, what are you going to do about it? How about this? Stop mucking around with teaching English. Stop fooling around with sugar mamas. Stop pissing off your relatives including your wife. And stop blaming all of your problems on other people. Get a real job and fix your broken relationships. Just do it!

 

[Sudsy]

Sudsy hasn't heard anything about this and from what I gather from his posts, he works in a field that relates to a lot of this type stuff.

Yep, we deal with people going through PR apps all the time, though we're informally supportive and usually recommend people get an attorney if they're in a complex situation.

And this really is the first time I've heard of someone being asked to provide pension records for a PR application.

Everyone in my firm figured this was going to be coming down the pipeline as part of the overall integration that came along with the MyNumber system - apparently we weren't wrong. I expect that they're testing the waters with PR applications, and will soon be requiring this for working/spouse visa renewals.

 

[TokyoJoeblow]

Yep, we deal with people going through PR apps all the time, though we're informally supportive and usually recommend people get an attorney if they're in a complex situation.

And this really is the first time I've heard of someone being asked to provide pension records for a PR application.

Everyone in my firm figured this was going to be coming down the pipeline as part of the overall integration that came along with the MyNumber system - apparently we weren't wrong. I expect that they're testing the waters with PR applications, and will soon be requiring this for working/spouse visa renewals.

So is my situation interesting enough that you talked about it with your coworkers to see what they think?

I agree with you all that they are testing the waters with me. I'm the prototype. New PR/Pension test beta. Testing the waters...the toilet waters...I feel like the turd that they are so desperately trying to flush!

 

[warubuta]

So is my situation interesting enough that you talked about it with your coworkers to see what they think?

I agree with you all that they are testing the waters with me. I'm the prototype. New PR/Pension test beta. Testing the waters...the toilet waters...I feel like the turd that they are so desperately trying to flush!

Nice imagery. And accurate too.

 

[TokyoJoeblow]

Nice imagery. And accurate too.

A candid photo of my last visit to the immigration office.

 

[TokyoJoeblow]

@Sudsy Btw, the official name of the form I need to provide printed on the letter:

被保険者記録紹介回答書　(Insurance Record Introduction Answer)

I assume this might be your first time even hearing of such a form?

 

[Sudsy]

被保険者記録紹介回答書

I think you mean 被保険者記録照会回答票.

That's a standard pension service form, basically a record of your contributions.

 

[TokyoJoeblow]

I think you mean 被保険者記録照会回答票.

That's a standard pension service form, basically a record of your contributions.

Wow that is funny because I know the Japanese kanji well but I was typing too fast lol.

But immigration doesn't often request this form right?

 

[Sudsy]

immigration doesn't often request this form right?

Like I said, this is the first time I have heard of them requesting pension records.

 

[TokyoJoeblow]

Like I said, this is the first time I have heard of them requesting pension records.

Relax dude, that was before I mentioned the official name of the form.

Just making sure you understood me clearly lol.

 

[Sudsy]

Just making sure you understood me clearly lol.

As was I, wasn't meant to come off tense.

 

[TokyoJoeblow]

Update:

So I called immigration directly and asked them if being on exemption status for the national pension will lead to a rejection of my permanent residence application.

I realize people are going to think doing this is a stupid thing to do and that is fine. I'm just tired of all the speculation and researching online without coming up with definite answers.

I also realize each PR application process is case by case, but I figured talking with one of the friendly immigration staff members would be worth a shot.

He was actually really polite and kind over the phone. He told me that he isn't able to give me an answer as it is ultimately up to the person in charge of my application.

He did answer another question I had. I mentioned to him that one problem I have had for a while is that I receive many full-time teaching job offers but all the schools are located outside Shizuoka City. I mentioned that according to Japanese immigration law, I'm supposed to be living together with my wife, which means I need to find a full-time job here in Shizuoka City and there aren't many. The ones I have found here never seem to be hiring as the countryside companies tend to hire teachers and hold onto them tightly and of course the teachers hold onto these jobs tightly knowing there aren't many other offers should they quit. So as a result, I told him that I often turn down these job offers outside Shizuoka City for fear that my marriage will look fake should I be working and living in another city.

He told me something quite unexpected. He said that it is totally OK to take up a full-time job outside the city where my wife lives. He also mentioned that it is also OK to not only be working in another city, but to be living in another city. He did say that I would need to make visits to my wife each month or week if possible and show proof of this in the form of tickets/receipts.

Now I know that he is just one person working at the immigration office, but it would be strange of another staff member would say the opposite is true. I guess it is a possibility, but I believe that this man was giving me accurate information.

He also mentioned that it is OK if I'm living at a different address in the city I work full-time in as long as the registered address is the same as my wife.

I realize that some people on here are going to say that they already know this but this is for the people that think living separately from wife = guaranteed deportation without question

 

[Sudsy]

He said that it is totally OK to take up a full-time job outside the city where my wife lives. He also mentioned that it is also OK to not only be working in another city, but to be living in another city. He did say that I would need to make visits to my wife each month or week if possible and show proof of this in the form of tickets/receipts.

This is absolutely accurate. I have several friends and colleagues who work in Tokyo while their families live in the countryside - one as far away as Aomori. They go home one or twice a month and on holidays, and live in Tokyo the rest of the time. This is not at all unusual in Japan, and is common enough that there's a name for it - tanshin funin (単身赴任). Several of them are on spouse visas and never have issues with renewals, as everything can easily be verified with paperwork.

He also mentioned that it is OK if I'm living at a different address in the city I work full-time in as long as the registered address is the same as my wife.

Keep in mind that this doesn't apply if the city you work full time in is also the same city your wife lives in.

 

[Frenchy]

> He said that it is totally OK to take up a full-time job outside the city where my wife lives. He also mentioned that it is also OK to not only be working in another city, but to be living in another city. He did say that I would need to make visits to my wife each month or week if possible and show proof of this in the form of tickets/receipts.

This is absolutely accurate. I have several friends and colleagues who work in Tokyo while their families live in the countryside - one as far away as Aomori. They go home one or twice a month and on holidays, and live in Tokyo the rest of the time. This is not at all unusual in Japan, and is common enough that there's a name for it - tanshin funin (単身赴任). Several of them are on spouse visas and never have issues with renewals, as everything can easily be verified with paperwork.

> He also mentioned that it is OK if I'm living at a different address in the city I work full-time in as long as the registered address is the same as my wife.

Keep in mind that this doesn't apply if the city you work full time in is also the same city your wife lives in.

Interesting. So if I move in Tokyo to Blabla-ku and she still lives in Tagada-ku, but my registered address is still Tagada-ku, I don’t need to register at Blabla-ku, right?

 

[Sudsy]

Interesting. So if I move in Tokyo to Blabla-ku and she still lives in Tagada-ku, but my registered address is still Blabla-ku, I don’t need to register at Blabla-ku, right?

Immigration will look at the residential addresses and the work address, and if they think the difference in commute doesn't look significant enough to warrant living apart from a spouse, the red flags will go up.

So if your wife lived in Okutama, and you lived in Minato-ku during the week and worked in Roppongi, they would likely see that as somewhat normal - 30 hours a week of commuting time is onerous, and would impact your ability to work.

If your wife lived in Shibuya-ku, and you lived in Minato-ku while commuting to Shinjuku, they would likely be reaching for the "DENIED" stamp.

 

[Desktop]

Lots of Japanese who live on their own in Tokyo have their registered address at their parents place in Chiba or Saitama. They get the extra money from the train fare. I used to see a girl who lived up the street from her company but no one knew.

 

[Frenchy]

Immigration will look at the residential addresses and the work address, and if they think the difference in commute doesn't look significant enough to warrant living apart from a spouse, the red flags will go up.

So if your wife lived in Okutama, and you lived in Minato-ku during the week and worked in Roppongi, they would likely see that as somewhat normal - 30 hours a week of commuting time is onerous, and would impact your ability to work.

If your wife lived in Shibuya-ku, and you lived in Minato-ku while commuting to Shinjuku, they would likely be reaching for the "DENIED" stamp.

Thanks, very interesting. Well i have PR already so they can suck my d*** but I was wondering if apart from that I still need to register at my new ku.

 

[Frenchy]

Lots of Japanese who live on their own in Tokyo have their registered address at their parents place in Chiba or Saitama. They get the extra money from the train fare. I used to see a girl who lived up the street from her company but no one knew.

Yes as usual there is the law... and how it’s not applied

 

[Sudsy]

Thanks, very interesting. Well i have PR already so they can suck my d*** but I was wondering if apart from that I still need to register at my new ku.

Nope, you can have as many residences as you want, only one needs to be registered.