Russia BANNED from Tokyo 2020?

e-smile said:
compared to the population USA pollute twice more than China
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As someone who lived in Mainland China for 4 and a half years, I can without a shred of doubt say that you are wrong.

I'm also from the US, so I can compare.

I'm referring to air and water pollution. I assume you are trying to say that US citizens eat more and therefore waste more food, throw out more plastic from fast-food restaurants...but let's not forget that Chinese people also use their made in China products.

I had to literally stop living in Beijing and Shanghai because the air pollution gave me asthmatic reactions and bronchitis. That doesn't happen in the US.
 
Viggagadye said:
I would agree with this, except that the "entire world" uses those products the Chinese factories are manufacturing.

How many Chinese people are doing this really? That's like arguing that the US should be banned from the Olympics because of school shootings. Or Spain should be banned because of kidnappings. Or Australia should be banned because of shark attacks.

Still better than fake people.

And no, before you ask, I'm not Chinese, nor do I particularly like or hate China.
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Ok, so air pollution and water pollution effect the entire world unlike if someone is attacked by a shark in the ocean near Australia...and what gave you the idea that Chinese people are not fake?

Oh my poor young radish...
 
Ken1988 said:
A fair comparison should be on a per capita basis...
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_countries_by_greenhouse_gas_emissions_per_capita
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Have you ever been to or lived in Mainland China?

The sky in most of the major cities is completely gray...almost all year around. That gray is from air pollutants not just Seattle style rain clouds.

The sky in the US is mostly blue and beautiful because it is much less polluted.

Yes, the US pollutes too, but to say it is 2 times worse than China is unbelievable.
 
Banning countries from the Olympics for non-sports related is
TokyoJoeblow said:
Ok, so air pollution and water pollution effect the entire world unlike if someone is attacked by a shark in the ocean near Australia...and what gave you the idea that Chinese people are not fake?

Oh my poor young radish...
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Yeah, if you read a bit more carefully, you'd realise my point about school shootings and shark attacks (the second of which was a fucking joke) was in response to your "let's ban China from the Olympics because some of them run people over" argument.

TokyoJoeblow said:
The sky in the US is mostly blue and beautiful because it is much less polluted.
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Yup, because US companies do much of their manufacturing in China. Go figure.
 
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I'm a firm believer in "Fuck the Olympics"
 
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TokyoJoeblow said:
Yes, the US pollutes too, but to say it is 2 times worse than China is unbelievable.
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The US produces twice the CO2 per capita compared to China. You can find that basically anywhere, if you do a little research.
CO2 is not the only air pollution however and China is indeed worse in other areas that have less effect on the climate, but are more detrimental to health. So yes, the smog in China is much worse.
 
Viggagadye said:
Banning countries from the Olympics for non-sports related is


Yeah, if you read a bit more carefully, you'd realise my point about school shootings and shark attacks (the second of which was a fucking joke) was in response to your "let's ban China from the Olympics because some of them run people over" argument.



Yup, because US companies do much of their manufacturing in China. Go figure.
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You know who else does their manufacturing in China on a much larger scale?

Chinese companies.

It almost seems as if you don't want to blame China for anything.

China can accept manufacturing projects for US companies, but creating stricter laws on pollution is in their control and yet they do almost nothing to limit emissions.
 
RandomTokyoGuy said:
The US produces twice the CO2 per capita compared to China. You can find that basically anywhere, if you do a little research.
CO2 is not the only air pollution however and China is indeed worse in other areas that have less effect on the climate, but are more detrimental to health. So yes, the smog in China is much worse.
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The research I have done tells me that China is number one in the world for CO2 emissions. China produces more CO2 than the US and the EU combined.

Your source claiming that the US produces two times the amount of CO2 compared to China is most likely a statistics site created by someone who hates the US.
 
TokyoJoeblow said:
You know who else does their manufacturing in China on a much larger scale?

Chinese companies.

It almost seems as if you don't want to blame China for anything.

China can accept manufacturing projects for US companies, but creating stricter laws on pollution is in their control and yet they do almost nothing to limit emissions.
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Again, don't put words in my mouth.
At no point did I say China was blameless. I was pointing out your false comparison between air quality in the US as compared to China. China does a lot of shit wrong, including producing huge amounts of pollution.

However:
1) It's silly to think China is polluting the "entire world". Countries like India are also producing massive amounts of pollution. And as pointed out before, the foreign companies that make use of Chinese manufacturing while knowing the environmental consequences also share the blame. If you are going to ban countries for producing pollution, then other large scale polluters and countries that make use of them for manufacturing should also be banned. I guess we'll have an Olympic games with Fiji and Palau then. Cool.
2) If we're going down the road of banning countries from the Olympics for non-sports related issues, as you suggest, then China can't be the only one banned. Ban countries for war. Ban countries for human rights violations. Ban countries for having bad food. RIP Olympics.
3) Arguing that China should be banned from the Olympics because some Chinese people ran over some people in their cars is the same as arguing that any country in which murder takes place should be banned from the Olympics. Which is every country. RIP Olympics.

Your post was just you using an opportunity you perceived to hate on a country that you don't like. Which is fine, if that's how you want to be. But then it's also fine for people to call you out on it.
 
TokyoJoeblow said:
The research I have done tells me that China is number one in the world for CO2 emissions. China produces more CO2 than the US and the EU combined.

Your source claiming that the US produces two times the amount of CO2 compared to China is most likely a statistics site created by someone who hates the US.
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Ok, you claimed a few times that you are a native English speaker and and English teacher, but you don't understand the term "per capita"? If China produces two times the CO2 of the US, but has 4times the population, than the CO2 produced per capita of the US is twice as high as that of China.
It's not that difficult of a concept to grasp and one doesn't have to hate the US for that. This concept of normalisation is used in many contexts, cause it often makes sense to compare normalised numbers rather than absolute ones.
 
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TokyoJoeblow said:
Have you ever been to or lived in Mainland China?

The sky in most of the major cities is completely gray...almost all year around. That gray is from air pollutants not just Seattle style rain clouds.

The sky in the US is mostly blue and beautiful because it is much less polluted.

Yes, the US pollutes too, but to say it is 2 times worse than China is unbelievable.
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What you have observed in Beijing and some other major Chinese cities is absolutely correct, but really there's no need to panic...it's just a stage every great city has to painfully go through:

images.jpeg
Just like London in 1952

1_5RU9AlyLT-VHpEDHwCFpJQ.jpeg
Or LA in 1953

images (1).jpeg
Or NYC in 1956.

The problem with those Chinese cities is that they were about 6 decades left behind, so unfortunately you had to eye witness this ugliest stage of their transmutation very recently.

And the good news is that it took Beijing much less time to recover as compared to London and LA (although I bet you don't really care).
 
Viggagadye said:
Again, don't put words in my mouth.
At no point did I say China was blameless. I was pointing out your false comparison between air quality in the US as compared to China. China does a lot of shit wrong, including producing huge amounts of pollution.

However:
1) It's silly to think China is polluting the "entire world". Countries like India are also producing massive amounts of pollution. And as pointed out before, the foreign companies that make use of Chinese manufacturing while knowing the environmental consequences also share the blame. If you are going to ban countries for producing pollution, then other large scale polluters and countries that make use of them for manufacturing should also be banned. I guess we'll have an Olympic games with Fiji and Palau then. Cool.
2) If we're going down the road of banning countries from the Olympics for non-sports related issues, as you suggest, then China can't be the only one banned. Ban countries for war. Ban countries for human rights violations. Ban countries for having bad food. RIP Olympics.
3) Arguing that China should be banned from the Olympics because some Chinese people ran over some people in their cars is the same as arguing that any country in which murder takes place should be banned from the Olympics. Which is every country. RIP Olympics.

Your post was just you using an opportunity you perceived to hate on a country that you don't like. Which is fine, if that's how you want to be. But then it's also fine for people to call you out on it.
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I agree that India pollutes a ton as well and that many countries should be banned. Actually, I don't even see the point in the Olympics. It is just a huge waste of money.
 
RandomTokyoGuy said:
Ok, you claimed a few times that you are a native English speaker and and English teacher, but you don't understand the term "per capita"? If China produces two times the CO2 of the US, but has 4times the population, than the CO2 produced per capita of the US is twice as high as that of China.
It's not that difficult of a concept to grasp and one doesn't have to hate the US for that. This concept of normalisation is used in many contexts, cause it often makes sense to compare normalised numbers rather than absolute ones.
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No, I understand what per capita means of course.

Whether you are looking at per capita or not, China still overall (as in it's government not individual people) produces way more pollution.

I'm just looking at the big picture...which is a giant ugly gray sky...thanks China.
 
surak said:
What you have observed in Beijing and some other major Chinese cities is absolutely correct, but really there's no need to panic...it's just a stage every great city has to painfully go through:

View attachment 12981
Just like London in 1952

View attachment 12982
Or LA in 1953

View attachment 12983
Or NYC in 1956.

The problem with those Chinese cities is that they were about 6 decades left behind, so unfortunately you had to eye witness this ugliest stage of their transmutation very recently.

And the good news is that it took Beijing much less time to recover as compared to London and LA (although I bet you don't really care).
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There is one large detail you are missing. Unlike people that faced these levels of pollution in London, LA and NY, the Chinese people overall (especially in government) don't give a flying fuck about cleaning it up at all.

In fact, in the face of endless criticism, the members of the Chinese government waste the peoples' tax money on having private feasts at fancy restaurants in Beijing instead of investing the money into projects to clean up the pollution.

When I lived in Beijing, I made friends with a Chinese woman who worked in the government and she would sometimes get invited to these big, expensive dinner parties...all on the tax payer's dime...how nice.
 
TokyoJoeblow said:
There is one large detail you are missing. Unlike people that faced these levels of pollution in London, LA and NY, the Chinese people overall (especially in government) don't give a flying fuck about cleaning it up at all.

In fact, in the face of endless criticism, the members of the Chinese government waste the peoples' tax money on having private feasts at fancy restaurants in Beijing instead of investing the money into projects to clean up the pollution.

When I lived in Beijing, I made friends with a Chinese woman who worked in the government and she would sometimes get invited to these big, expensive dinner parties...all on the tax payer's dime...how nice.
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It seems that you've been staying in China for more than 4 years but still failed to understand how this country functions: China is an evil authoritarian/totalitarian state, where people don't (and can't) give a flying fuck to literally anything; also there's no need for people to give a flying fuck to get things done; the evil dictators just do things.

In the case of pollution control, the dictators took some evil and economically/politically suicidal measures such as seizing 500 million hectres of croplands from innocent farmers for re-forestation. And here's the result:

Screen Shot 2019-05-15 at 15.57.10.png

Also, I fail to see why wasting taxpayer's money and cleaning up pollutions are mutually exclusive. Unlike most other governments that are constantly restraint by tight budgets and growing debts, the dictatorship of China actually can afford extravagant dinner parties and full-scale pollution controls at the same time. Some of those giga projects that you are not aware of are extremely ambitious and costy, such as turning 9 million hectres of deserts near Beijing into permanent green fields, but no worries they still have enough pocket money for dinner parties.
 
warubuta said:
This thread was originally about cheating at sports until you numb nuts hijacked it into another boring argument about pollution.
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"Win if you can, lose if you must, but always Cheat"
 
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just4fun said:
Yes I do but I don't think it's one of his.
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You know, you’re right, that’s Jesse Ventura. Sounds exactly like something that came out of the Notebooks of Lazarus Long.
 
Sudsy said:
You know, you’re right, that’s Jesse Ventura. Sounds exactly like something that came out of the Notebooks of Lazarus Long.
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Jesse stole that too......hahahaha
It's funny as shit though isn't it?
 
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