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Shrewd Sugar: Sugar Dating vs Relationships for me

No offense intended, but given how you compute and assess and compare everything , I feel a date with you must be as warm and affectionate as one with my PC when it’s on Excel.

Feeling the same way. I read the full post and it was very annoying to read. OP sounds very calculated as if she wrote everything down with a smirk on her face.
 
So you were talking about waxing or a he alternative to it. Yeah, 2 to 4 times of that is about 200K. I get it. So where’s the best place to get Sugaring done? Didn’t know they offered that in Tokyo. I’m stoked now. I just love Sugaring. The Sugar Bowl is not always sweet, but it can be. The Sugar Bowl is not always right, but it can be. The Sugar Bowl is not always perfectly shaped or colored, by it can be. The Sugar Bowl doesn’t always peaceful, but it can be. The Sugar Bowl sometimes has too much sugar, and sometimes not enough, and sometimes it’s bitter, and cold, and all those things you hate about the human condition, but it can be wonderful. Wonderful only if the two parties can be relatively trustworthy and honest about what each other wants or needs. From all the testimonials written by sugar babies 99 percent of them had sex with their SDs and many on the first date. The Sugar Bowl looks clean, but it’s got a messy, complicated grime that nobody wants to admit. It’s not supposed to be about greed, but it always is. It’s not always supposed to be about sex but it most certainly is. It’s not always supposed to be about money, but again it always is. “For the money, you have the time” is an ubiquitous expression that shouldn’t be misunderstood, but it can be. And the Sugar Bowl is often misunderstood as it should be. So what I want to know is if the bowl is sugar or is there sugar in the bowl? I’m not sure I understand the concept of a sugar bowl. Yes! I must make my own sugar bowl. Is there any specific type of sugar I should use? Brown? White? Raw? Black? Synthetic? Cotton like? Mixed? Flavored? Fruity? Corn starch? I’m off to my lab to make a sugar bowl for myself.

Deep, slow breaths. In through your nose and out through your mouth...as deep and slow as you can manage, until coherence returns. Repeat as necessary.

-Ww
 
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Maybe because most of the time one or both participants are not looking or even deliberately avoiding "real relationship"? Still even in the last couple of years I have had several regular p4p providers that we share our life details with each other, and I even non-exclusively dated one for couple of years. So I would not say it has been "very little chance" at least for me.

Same for me over the years and to varying degrees...and once very big time. I also know of numerous other cases of it happening. "Real relationships" and even "real romances" (not identical and rarer) are far from impossible or so rare as to be irrelevant.

-Ww
 
Feeling the same way. I read the full post and it was very annoying to read. OP sounds very calculated as if she wrote everything down with a smirk on her face.

Whether or not one likes what @DanniCake had to say about her views of sugaring and whatever one might have inferred about her attitude or personality (projection of oneself is an always present danger when reading what others post!), I think we should all be happy that she shared her thoughts with us and welcome any SB who does so (aside from trolling or direct/intentional drama generation...neither the case here I think). Both on TAG and in general, we hear far too little from the ladies in the sugar bowl, and you don't have to agree with something to make it worth knowing or hearing of course.

That said and fwiiw, I also think Danni's rather transactional/negotiation (balancing what I get with what I give) approach to sugaring is not a particularly good one, although it is very common and can work.

Imo and experience, far more wonderful and satisfying relationships, in or out of the sugar bowl, are likely to develop if you simply try to be as generous and giving (in all senses/resources/aspects) as you practically can be without thinking too much about what you receive in return. Some people, maybe even most, will try to take advantage of you when you treat them in such a way, but the substantial number who respond in kind more than make up for the selfish ones in the long run. And, as the old saying about marriages goes, "If it feels like you are giving 90% and getting 10%, the truth *might* be close to 50-50!"

-Ww
 
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Just an observation, another factor in the mix has to be if the SD is married. While everyone is different, I imagine that a lot of guys who do P4P are not going to do sugaring cause that would really piss off the wife. Just out of curiosity, are there any SDs who are married and if so, what do you think of the risk/benefit tradeoff. Danni (and any others who may want to delurk), does marriage disqualify someone from being an SD?
 
Just an observation, another factor in the mix has to be if the SD is married. While everyone is different, I imagine that a lot of guys who do P4P are not going to do sugaring cause that would really piss off the wife. Just out of curiosity, are there any SDs who are married and if so, what do you think of the risk/benefit tradeoff. Danni (and any others who may want to delurk), does marriage disqualify someone from being an SD?
I’m still officially married, but separated for a few years now, and a SD. It’s totally fine by me. :)
 
Just an observation, another factor in the mix has to be if the SD is married. While everyone is different, I imagine that a lot of guys who do P4P are not going to do sugaring cause that would really piss off the wife. Just out of curiosity, are there any SDs who are married and if so, what do you think of the risk/benefit tradeoff. Danni (and any others who may want to delurk), does marriage disqualify someone from being an SD?

The majority of SDs are married I am pretty sure, and many put it in their profiles. In a few more years, I will have been married for 50 years!

-Ww
 
Just an observation, another factor in the mix has to be if the SD is married. While everyone is different, I imagine that a lot of guys who do P4P are not going to do sugaring cause that would really piss off the wife. Just out of curiosity, are there any SDs who are married and if so, what do you think of the risk/benefit tradeoff. Danni (and any others who may want to delurk), does marriage disqualify someone from being an SD?
Echoing @Frenchy & @Wwanderer
I'd say the vast majority of SD are married, and use the sugar bowl to get back what has been missing in their tired marriages.

@Wwanderer 50 years... respect. I'm coming up on 25.
 
Just an observation, another factor in the mix has to be if the SD is married. While everyone is different, I imagine that a lot of guys who do P4P are not going to do sugaring cause that would really piss off the wife. Just out of curiosity, are there any SDs who are married and if so, what do you think of the risk/benefit tradeoff. Danni (and any others who may want to delurk), does marriage disqualify someone from being an SD?
With my roommate she won't deal with Married Men and I know a lot of SB's won't.
In part because she doesn't want to deal with the drama that comes from a guy sneaking around behind his wife, like I said being a sugar baby is hypothetically supposed to be like being a girlfriend only without the demands of this relationship leading to marriage and children so keeping everything fun and light and open, if a guy is constantly sweating that his wife might find out then that restricts a SB from being able to go out with her SD, and prevents them from taking trips, (from shopping to vacation) going out to smaller things like movies or events, like a large part of the "fun" in a relationship gets cut off because if his wife/mutual friends see him out with another woman shit hits the fan.

The second reason is because in Japan SPECIFICALLY there is still the law on the books that if a man cheats on his wife (or fiancé) with another woman, the wife can SUE the other woman for finances lost, so most babies don't ever want to have to deal with that (and I've heard whispers of guys that will intentionally try to get a SB in order to allow his wife to sue them for more money than he put into the relationship, kind of a way to blackmail or bankrupt a SB, I don't know if this has happened in actuality but it's a myth that spooks enough people to be wary)

Myself, if a married man approaches me I'll ask him if his wife knows, if she doesn't I'll try to convince him to talk to her about whatever issues he's having in his relationship with her first and see if they can't come to an arrangement themselves. And if he really thinks it's unfixable then maybe to talk to her honestly about separating instead because while I can totally understand and get behind having an open marriage or having a roommate relationship with a woman, if you're really miserable in your marriage and not getting anything out of it then basically you're paying someone to annoy you in your own house.

In the end if he insisted that this was what he wanted and he wanted it with me I would probably request a fair bit for the aspect of "discretion" (doubly so if he expected me to be monogamous to him.)
 
With my roommate she won't deal with Married Men and I know a lot of SB's won't.
In part because she doesn't want to deal with the drama that comes from a guy sneaking around behind his wife, like I said being a sugar baby is hypothetically supposed to be like being a girlfriend only without the demands of this relationship leading to marriage and children so keeping everything fun and light and open, if a guy is constantly sweating that his wife might find out then that restricts a SB from being able to go out with her SD, and prevents them from taking trips, (from shopping to vacation) going out to smaller things like movies or events, like a large part of the "fun" in a relationship gets cut off because if his wife/mutual friends see him out with another woman shit hits the fan.

The second reason is because in Japan SPECIFICALLY there is still the law on the books that if a man cheats on his wife (or fiancé) with another woman, the wife can SUE the other woman for finances lost, so most babies don't ever want to have to deal with that (and I've heard whispers of guys that will intentionally try to get a SB in order to allow his wife to sue them for more money than he put into the relationship, kind of a way to blackmail or bankrupt a SB, I don't know if this has happened in actuality but it's a myth that spooks enough people to be wary)

Myself, if a married man approaches me I'll ask him if his wife knows, if she doesn't I'll try to convince him to talk to her about whatever issues he's having in his relationship with her first and see if they can't come to an arrangement themselves. And if he really thinks it's unfixable then maybe to talk to her honestly about separating instead because while I can totally understand and get behind having an open marriage or having a roommate relationship with a woman, if you're really miserable in your marriage and not getting anything out of it then basically you're paying someone to annoy you in your own house.

In the end if he insisted that this was what he wanted and he wanted it with me I would probably request a fair bit for the aspect of "discretion" (doubly so if he expected me to be monogamous to him.)
Meh
 
Whether or not one likes what @DanniCake had to say about her views of sugaring and whatever one might have inferred about her attitude or personality (projection of oneself is an always present danger when reading what others post!), I think we should all be happy that she shared her thoughts with us and welcome any SB who does so (aside from trolling or direct/intentional drama generation...neither the case here I think). Both on TAG and in general, we hear far too little from the ladies in the sugar bowl, and you don't have to agree with something to make it worth knowing or hearing of course.

That said and fwiiw, I also think Danni's rather transactional/negotiation (balancing what I get with what I give) approach to sugaring is not a particularly good one, although it is very common and can work.

Imo and experience, far more wonderful and satisfying relationships, in or out of the sugar bowl, are likely to develop if you simply try to be as generous and giving (in all senses/resources/aspects) as you practically can be without thinking too much about what you receive in return. Some people, maybe even most, will try to take advantage of you when you treat them in such a way, but the substantial number who respond in kind more than make up for the selfish ones in the long run. And, as the old saying about marriages goes, "If it feels like you are giving 90% and getting 10%, the truth *might* be close to 50-50!"

-Ww

In real life I'm not like just tabulating cost and risk assessments of what I can gain or fleece out of people, in fact calculating things like this is an attempt for me to be a bit harder and stick to my guns.
My roommate won't go out and meet anyone unless they are offering her a minimum of "transportation funds" (i.e 10k like you get when you go on a sugar date with UC) and she dated a guy just to have him drive her around in his Porsche and when he sold it she stopped seeing him because she was only into him for the car. Whereas I've met two people already without requesting (or receiving) any funds just because we had enough in common that I wanted to meet them. Hell I even talked one guy into going into couples therapy with his wife instead of wasting his time with me. (I don't know if he actually followed up on that or just found a baby that would deal with him for a cheaper price, the point being that I actually DO CARE that whomever I'm around is happy.)

I guess just a lot of my friends who Sugar have "A Price" in their mind and if guys don't immediately offer or hit that price it's just an automatic "No" (Much like escorts who have their marked hourly rates, if you don't offer that then they'd just say no) whereas I feel like I should take it on a case by case basis based on how much I personally LIKE the SD, I'd be okay with some of the Splenda Daddies who don't have much to offer on SA if we have a lot of mutual shared interests, I'd even be okay with some of the guys who don't want a SB but are using SA as a regular dating site as long as they're guys I'm interested in, I guess I'm just using TAG as a bit of a sounding board to see what guys who Sugar are looking for, like do they just want an escort? (And if so why not just do that instead of seeking a SB? What are they getting from a Sugar relationship that they wouldn't from an escort? Are SB just cheaper escorts to them since SB's don't charge explicitly by the hour?

A part of me was hoping to talk to more SB's since while I know like two and occasionally bump into a few others to hear snippits I'm curious what they think when they go on Sugar dates (although I'm seeing this isn't really the board for that)

Another part of me was somewhat hoping to be able to use this as an open form to just chat with a POT to just really see what they're really looking for and really offering with brutal honesty. In the SA messages I ask guys to be honest but you can tell most of the time they're still trying to act a certain way because deep down they're salt or splenda daddies trying to pretend their not.
 
his wife might find out then that restricts a SB from being able to go out with her SD, and prevents them from taking trips, (from shopping to vacation) going out to smaller things like movies or events, like a large part of the "fun" in a relationship gets cut off because if his wife/mutual friends see him out with another woman shit hits the fan.

This might be true in some cases, but ime it is wildly inaccurate as a generalization. There are various ways around the problem depending on the devilish details. I am speaking here not only about my own sugaring experiences but also about many other sugar arrangements of which I’ve heard from one of the partners, usually SBs talking about their previous arrangements.

Myself, if a married man approaches me I'll ask him if his wife knows,...

Uh, you are aware that people sometimes lie, right? This includes married men lying about being married. And if he will lie to his wife about you, do you think he would hesitate to lie to you about her?

I get the impression that you are talking more from theory than experience on some of these topics. Right?

My SA profile indicates that I am married, and I always mention it when I first meet a pot SB just in case she missed or forgot it, but SBs tell me that many/most SDs handle the issue differently.

-Ww
 
The second reason is because in Japan SPECIFICALLY there is still the law on the books that if a man cheats on his wife (or fiancé) with another woman, the wife can SUE the other woman for finances lost, so most babies don't ever want to have to deal with that

No such law. It's a tort case under the Civil Code Article 709 and 710 by which the wife can sue both her husband and his adultery partner for compensation for the damage caused by them. Japan is not that exotic...
 
This might be true in some cases, but ime it is wildly inaccurate as a generalization. There are various ways around the problem depending on the devilish details. I am speaking here not only about my own sugaring experiences but also about many other sugar arrangements of which I’ve heard from one of the partners, usually SBs talking about their previous arrangements.



Uh, you are aware that people sometimes lie, right? This includes married men lying about being married. And if he will lie to his wife about you, do you think he would hesitate to lie to you about her?

I get the impression that you are talking more from theory than experience on some of these topics. Right?

My SA profile indicates that I am married, and I always mention it when I first meet a pot SB just in case she missed or forgot it, but SBs tell me that many/most SDs handle the issue differently.

-Ww

Yes, I haven't been in the Sugar Bowl for long and mostly I wanted to see what it was like just based on things that I hear from my roommate, another friend, and a few other SB's I've bumped into, and maybe it's because I'm on SA so late in the game, maybe it's because I'm just not the type of girl who's designed to Sugar Date, but my experiences in Sugar Dating are rather slim, a lot of chatting but not much actual action.

My only real SW experience I suppose was being a FinDom for a year, which may also be where my calculating nature comes from, but while doing that was fun and I still chat with my old subs as friends, it's surprisingly exhausting and I really didn't like it.
 
The second reason is because in Japan SPECIFICALLY there is still the law on the books that if a man cheats on his wife (or fiancé) with another woman, the wife can SUE the other woman for finances lost, so most babies don't ever want to have to deal with that (and I've heard whispers of guys that will intentionally try to get a SB in order to allow his wife to sue them for more money than he put into the relationship, kind of a way to blackmail or bankrupt a SB, I don't know if this has happened in actuality but it's a myth that spooks enough people to be wary)

I think you'll find this does not apply to transnational relationships. Hence SB type relationships are prob excluded
 
No such law. It's a tort case under the Civil Code Article 709 and 710 by which the wife can sue both her husband and his adultery partner for compensation for the damage caused by them. Japan is not that exotic...
I love it when somebody has detailed facts from a definitive source. Unfortunately this doesnt really contradict the assertion that the other woman can be sued. I wish it did. Regardless, it is all a load of bullshit anyway. When was the last time anybody actually collected damages? Last fucking Nevuary, thats when.
 
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I love it when somebody has detailed facts from a definitive source. Unfortunately this doesnt really contradict the assertion that the other woman can be sued. I wish it did. Regardless, it is all a load of bullshit anyway. When was the last time anybody actually collected damages? Last fucking Nevuary, thats when.
Fact: Japanese woman that was a member of our social group was seeing a married man. Wife found out, our friend got sued and wound up paying something like 2m yen. It was a ridiculous and sobering experience.
 
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Fact: Japanese woman that was a member of our social group was seeing a married man. Wife found out, our friend got sued and wound up paying something like 2m yen. It was a ridiculous and sobering experience.
Wow! I guess it does happen.
 
I’m not sure if SBs can even be sued.
Usually if the cheater is paying for it, like with fuuzoku, sueing doesn’t work. So that could be brought up as a defense. Although if the relationship was really intimate and a threat to the marriage, this may not suffice.
 
Wow! I guess it does happen.
I wonder though if the married person is paying money, as would be the case in SB, wouldn't that, in a sense, shift responsibility back to the married person and away from the SB. Otherwise wouldn't every service provider be vulnerable to this kind of suit? It's like a drunk trying to sue a bartender for his liver damage.
 
I’m not sure if SBs can even be sued.
Usually if the cheater is paying for it, like with fuuzoku, sueing doesn’t work. So that could be brought up as a defense. Although if the relationship was really intimate and a threat to the marriage, this may not suffice.
what i just said.
 
Wow! I guess it does happen.

Yep, but what made you so confident that it never happened? Did that seemed self-evident to you or something? An honest question...just wondering in other words. While such suits are kind of weird, they are far from the weirdest things I've heard of in Japanese, or even US, legal matters.

-Ww
 
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In real life I'm not like just tabulating cost and risk assessments of what I can gain or fleece out of people, in fact calculating things like this is an attempt for me to be a bit harder and stick to my guns. ...

To be clear, it was not my intention to try to persuade you to change your approach, and I very much appreciate that you explained it in detail here. And I think the D&D-inspired Excel-like SD scoring system is cute and almost charming/endearing in a geeky way. Rather I just intended to comment on the basis of my sugaring experiences and suggest that there may be better ways to go.

Anyway, good luck with it, and I hope you soon find some sugar action yourself; it is out there if you look long and carefully enough.

-Ww
 
I love it when somebody has detailed facts from a definitive source. Unfortunately this doesnt really contradict the assertion that the other woman can be sued. I wish it did. Regardless, it is all a load of bullshit anyway. When was the last time anybody actually collected damages? Last fucking Nevuary, thats when.

Like I said it's tort. The law just says anyone can sue some else for compensation when the plaintiff's right, which is supposed to be legally protected, was violated by the defendant. It's the same as the US.
 
Like I said it's tort. The law just says anyone can sue some else for compensation when the plaintiff's right, which is supposed to be legally protected, was violated by the defendant. It's the same as the US.

Afaik, the difference in this context is that this specific type of suit (against the paramour of one’s spouse) is rare to non-existent in the US and probably wouldn’t succeed, but it happens frequently and successfully enough in Japan that there is even a sort of informal standard award to the plantiff for the “damages”. Just my understanding. I’d be happy to learn more from those better informed though.

-Ww