Some Field Experiences And Reflections

[Timoleon]

Hello everyone, for the last weeks I dated some J-girls and I would like to hear some feedback from you guys here.

Since I live in a somewhat small city, I got all these contacts from Pairs and Tinder. Getting the Line contact and going to the date take between a week - 2 weeks (depends on my schedule). My main aim was to try and bed the girl on the first date, and only drinking a little so I don't end up depending on alcohol for the date to go smoothly. Also, I only pay for my stuff. I referenced some Nanpa blogs in Japanese on how to make up a date plan, as the dating scene looks quite different from my homecountry. So I get the logistics down and get to it:

1) First girl from Tinder. We meet at an Izakaya in Nanba (Osaka) and spend around 1:30-2 hours there. Then I take her to a gamecenter, where we play around some games and Purikura. After that I take to a Karaoke boot, where we make out. From there, we go to a love hotel and spend the night there as the last train would be departing shortly. I meet here another day in Osaka again, we do some sightseeing, get dinner and go to a love hotel again. Third time I tried to ask her out, she stops replying even though the mood seemed good for me. I get the message and move on.

2) Second girl from Pairs. I meet her at a night event that took place in my city. We spend there around 1 hour, going around and chatting. Then I take her to a nearby Izakaya, where we continue talking for around 2 hours. I tell her to come to my house to check out some of my paintings (I paint as a hobby), so we go in her car to my house and end up having sex shortly. After we finish, we cuddle a little and she goes back in her car. I send her a mail thanking her for the night blabla and suggest to go to Osaka next time or sth. She says she wants to see me again but starts making excuses that she is busy because it was her birthday this month and got lots of invitations from friends etc. I kind of get the message and leave it at that in a friendly way (Sth like "ok, text me when you are free". Actually, it would have been better sth like "Ok, I will text you in a few weeks" instead of putting the initiative to her). But whatever, looks like a closed case.

3) Third and fourth girls from Pairs. I run the same date plan for Tinder girl, but they didn't want to make at the Karaoke. I leave it at that and move on.

4) Fifth girl from Pairs. We meet at an Izakaya in my city. We spend there around 2 hours and I go back. Now planning a second meeting at my place for a movie/check the paintings and escalate from there (more on this later).

6) Sixth girl from Pairs. We meet at a coffee shop in my city for about an hour and have a fun chat. I tell her to go and check the castle that was nearby as she never went there. We go around there for a bit and I invite here to come to my house to see the paintings (never thought painting would be that useful lol). We go back, foul around a bit and end up kissing, but she didn't want to escalate from there. After I try a few more times to escalate, I leave it at that and she goes back. From here on, I think it would be difficult to recover. This date was WAY too fast (less than 3 hours, or 2:30 maybe) but I wanted to give it a try to see how it went.

Some stuff I noticed

• I think that the main problem here is that the dates are too short to end up in sex because it makes the girls feel "easy" and there isn't enough trust there. Again, all these dates were under 4 hours, first time meeting. They did work two times but failed 3, so while it's possible, it doesn't look too reliable. That's way I thought that making a first date for meeting and building trust, and a second date to escalate at my house for movie/dinner/painting/whatever would not make them feel easy because it is the second time they meet me. I still need to try this out though. Another option would be to try long single dates (4+hours) with venue changes, but that means spending more money and time.

• Physical escalation is kind of difficult in Japan because public displays of affection are not socially acceptable (probably everyone noticed already), so I thought of the Karaoke booth. I end up holding hands with all of them and doing some light kino like touching but only that in public. So I escalate in Karaoke/my house.

• Pairs is more of a relantionship-oriented site so perhaps girls think is "not okay" to have sex on the first meeting (not sure about this). Tinder works but gets me low results (not many matches, many people just stop talking so you need to get the Line ASAP).

• All dates were in Japanese. I have a high Japanese level, but of course is not native, so I may stumble sometimes. Not many ways around this, just keep chatting people. Trying to slow down is a good option too. I was actually thinking of trying English-only dates with girls who could keep up and see if there are any differences in their responses. English is not my native language but I can handle it better than Japanese.

• Japanese girls tend to ghost out and flat out stop replying. Judging them for what they do (showing up, going on dates, getting intimate) is the only way to go.

• I'm actually curious to see if it's possible to recover in the sixth girl's scenerario, but failing to escalate looks quite bad. I see two options, a) play her game, take it slowly and go on a somewhat long date and try to escalate from there. But now she is setting the frame of the relantionship. Or b) just invite her directly to my house for whatever, but I don't think she will be OK with it.

• I got more contacts but my schedule doens't allow me to meet them all, so some contacts go cold after a while. I'm trying to space out getting contacts to avoid this. I first "sweep" nearly all the contacts I have and start getting new ones.

• Leading is key here. Girls won't start anything at all, so it's up to you, which is good because you can decide how the date goes. On the other hand, it can be a steep learning curve (language, different venues, different culture, etc). Your Japanese really makes it or breaks it in my opinion.

• I don't know how to get them in a sex conversation. I can get them to talk about relationships no problem, but I can't take it to the next level. Maybe in a Japanese context this is not so normal?

• As probably lots of you noticed, being white doesn't mean 100% success, even with girls who want to meet gaijins. You need to bring something more to the table than your skin colour.

Well, this was a bit long. I have more dates lined up so I can continue trying different stuff, but I wanted to share these experiences and get some feedback from you guys. Some advices or ideas? Similar experiences?

Cheers

 

[RickyJ]

I applaud your analysis and I did take the time and read your post. I did the same thing back in the Cali prior to getting committed but this time from Asian-Hispanic background towards White, Asian, Hispanic and Black ladies.

It does get more conplicated at times since backgrounds do change and on a whim shifting of train of though in between ladies.

In comparison to your time line, I've only been lucky a few times to get laid on a first date (asian and white) which is usually a half a day event... i lame the driving distances lol
but they tyoucally bites between the 3rd to the 5th day between text, coffee, bar and redbox (I'm not that old).

I may not address some of your concerns with regards to japanese Women but always remember this: "Is the Juice worth the Squeeze?"

nampa/pua/dating/fling is mostly one sided... you may try to think that its mutual but this is our way to learn ourselves and eventually find out true match in life.

 

[TokyoML]

Thanks for the these reports...

I love reading these real life dating stories. Keep us posted

 

[DocMcStuffins]

Just curious - do you define the first two dates as successes? Did they seem to enjoy the sex?

 

[Timoleon]

@DocMcStuffins

Just curious - do you define the first two dates as successes? Did they seem to enjoy the sex?

Short answer: yes, I would define them as a successes as the dates were planned to lead to sex; and yes, they seemed to enjoy it.

But, the more I think about it, it's kind of difficult to say if a date is 'successful' or not. Dates 3 and 4 were failures? Both girls showed up on time, we enjoyed some time together, but they didn't want to get physicial. There weren't 'successful' because I was aiming for that, but in the end, they were two nice dates with J-girls. And they gave me some thought material for future dates. In the end, it depends on your expectations.

I would say that success can range from having a nice date, making out, sex, pushing your own boundaries, learning something new, etc, and failure can be anything from flaking, girl has a bad personality or is way too shy, you behave like an idiot for whatever reason, language or cultural barrier gets too thick, she expects you to pay for everything even if you don't want to, your date plan doesn't go okay, etc. Some things depends on you, some on her and some are just random.

 

[static]

First, nice job on taking action and getting out there.

Some stuff I noticed

• I think that the main problem here is that the dates are too short to end up in sex because it makes the girls feel "easy" and there isn't enough trust there. Again, all these dates were under 4 hours, first time meeting. They did work two times but failed 3, so while it's possible, it doesn't look too reliable. That's way I thought that making a first date for meeting and building trust, and a second date to escalate at my house for movie/dinner/painting/whatever would not make them feel easy because it is the second time they meet me. I still need to try this out though. Another option would be to try long single dates (4+hours) with venue changes, but that means spending more money and time.

One thing here that's often a misconception. It doesn't matter how long you're with a girl, but more the quality of the time and relationship you have with the girl during that time. You can go on 20 dates with a girl and fail at connecting to the girl to the point where she wants to go back home with you. There's also plenty of things on the girl's end. Maybe she's looking for a serious boyfriend and the past 20 dates she's been on, she slept with the guy and he disappeared, so she wants to hold out longer to make sure you're in it for the long haul. There's a wide array of reasons a girl wouldn't sleep with you on the first date, not all of them will be under your control. IMO, get a lot of these preconceived notions out of your mind about what girls want.

• Physical escalation is kind of difficult in Japan because public displays of affection are not socially acceptable (probably everyone noticed already), so I thought of the Karaoke booth. I end up holding hands with all of them and doing some light kino like touching but only that in public. So I escalate in Karaoke/my house.

You have a lot of different ways you can approach things here. First, physical escalation in public is not always necessary. There are plenty of guys out there who have sex with girls on the first date who don't touch girls at all. Then yes, public displays of affection are tacky here, but you can go further by completely blowing this out of the water in a fun and exciting way. Example: I was out with a girl once in Shinjuku, and she was way nervous. So I picked her up and put her on my shoulders, running around the sidewalk. She was having a blast, laughing, putting her arms out flying, etc. After that, she was a lot more comfortable in my physical space even though there was nothing really sexual about it.

• Pairs is more of a relantionship-oriented site so perhaps girls think is "not okay" to have sex on the first meeting (not sure about this). Tinder works but gets me low results (not many matches, many people just stop talking so you need to get the Line ASAP).

Again, your results may vary. Of all the Pairs dates I had, 3/4 of them ended up having sex with me on the first date. Refer to point #1

• All dates were in Japanese. I have a high Japanese level, but of course is not native, so I may stumble sometimes. Not many ways around this, just keep chatting people. Trying to slow down is a good option too. I was actually thinking of trying English-only dates with girls who could keep up and see if there are any differences in their responses. English is not my native language but I can handle it better than Japanese.

You speak good enough Japanese, but the girl is likely going to understand that it's not your native language and should cut you some leeway in that respect. If you make a mistake, laugh at yourself and say "ああ、日本語難しいね～" and keep going on. Remember, most of your communication isn't happening on the verbal level, it's happening in your sub communications. My Japanese isn't native either, but it was never the reason I failed with a girl.

• Japanese girls tend to ghost out and flat out stop replying. Judging them for what they do (showing up, going on dates, getting intimate) is the only way to go.

One thing here. I would never send out any sort of *final* messages to the girl. Sometimes you can end up resurrecting contact with a girl a year down the road, and reconnecting. This is a lot easier if the impression you left her with was positive. I agree with your assessment of sending "Message me when you're free." You can usually resurrect these contacts a few weeks later by sending her a picture or a video of where you currently are. "Man, Osaka castle is so beautiful in the evening!" *send picture* and that'll start up a conversation again usually.

• I'm actually curious to see if it's possible to recover in the sixth girl's scenerario, but failing to escalate looks quite bad. I see two options, a) play her game, take it slowly and go on a somewhat long date and try to escalate from there. But now she is setting the frame of the relantionship. Or b) just invite her directly to my house for whatever, but I don't think she will be OK with it.

This is where you have to make the decision for yourself. Do you want to see her again? Are you interested in putting time in to eventually sleep with her? How many dates are you willing to invest into her? Do you just want a one and done, or a longer term arrangement?

Once you answer these questions, you can really proceed. I mean, like I said above, if she's not ready to have sex with you, she won't. The important thing is that you never want to go too far passed her comfort zone. She doesn't want to be seen as just a piece of meat, so spend a date or two getting to know her. Invite her out to Kyoto for the weekend (far away from the location you previously escalated on her). Spend the day just talking and getting to know her and treat her like you would treat a girlfriend. On your way home, ride the train together and just start heading back towards your place. Don't invite her back, just start going there with her. If she's got objections, she'll let you know. You want to have a strong lead, but a gentle touch if that makes any sense. Pursue your desires, but you should have enough empathy to respect her wishes as well. If you're interested in a more long term arrangement (Not necessarily a girlfriend, but someone you can see regularly), she'll pick up on that and likely eventually sleep with you.

• I got more contacts but my schedule doens't allow me to meet them all, so some contacts go cold after a while. I'm trying to space out getting contacts to avoid this. I first "sweep" nearly all the contacts I have and start getting new ones.

These are the kinds of problems you like to have

• Leading is key here. Girls won't start anything at all, so it's up to you, which is good because you can decide how the date goes. On the other hand, it can be a steep learning curve (language, different venues, different culture, etc). Your Japanese really makes it or breaks it in my opinion.

Yes, yes, yes, yes! This is awesome!

• I don't know how to get them in a sex conversation. I can get them to talk about relationships no problem, but I can't take it to the next level. Maybe in a Japanese context this is not so normal?

"Hey, so I was online reading an article about how the police are starting to crack down on places for the Olympics! Love hotels, soap lands, and these things called happening bars. What is a happening bar? Have you ever been to one? Oh man, that sounds wild! Have you ever been? Aww why not? What's the craziest thing you've ever done in bed?"

Normalize the conversation, relate it to the real world and events going on are pretty simple ways to talk about sex with the girl. You can talk about her past boyfriends, how far she went with em, what's the craziest thing she did with em. Once you're in there, you can talk about fetishes you want to try out, etc. Keep an eye on her comfort level in the conversation and abort when things start getting uncomfortable for her. Remember, it's important that a girl be comfortable before she's going to open up to you. If you start talking about your S&M school girl orgy fantasy to a girl who's only had one sexual partner in her life, she may (not always) run for the hills. Other girls that could be a turn on, so you never know.

 

[Timoleon]

@static

Thanks for your commentaries, lots of stuff to think about. Specially on 'long time vs. quality time'.

BTW, I just tried the 'sent a picture to a cold contact', worked like a charm!

 

[zenfix12]

I had lots of sucesss meeting girls in Japan. Going there next month to meet 4 girls. Out of 8 years visiting Japan I had never had a girl want me to go to a love hotel. They preferred my regular hotel. Few Japanese girls told me it's low class and they had a negative image about it when I brought it up. All the girls I met wanted a long term relationship

So I think if you take a girl to a love hotel off the bat it might be just a one nighter short term fling more than anything since its not the optimal senario for a girl who wants to start a long relationship.

In a matter of fact some of my past dates would rather have sex in a private room izakaya than love hotel.

 

[Desktop]

Foreigners visiting Japan & living in Japan are different to some Japanese women. It's a way to leave Japan.

 

[Timoleon]

@zenfix12

I agree with your remarks on love hotels. Some girls have childish preconceptions about them, even when the ones I went are quite okay places. For example, an ex-girlfriend was quite adamant about them, even when we where already dating.

Often, I end up using them because of logistics. My place is clean and I don't mind anyone seen it, but it's a one-hour train trip from the closest big city location: Namba, Osaka. So between a close 10-minutes walk to a love hotel or a one-hour plus train trip to my house, it's the more convenient choice. Now, if the date is in the city I live or close by, then it's my place.