Sugaring vs Escorting : what do you prefer?

[IchigoDave]

@SoapFTW
It's weird but since I started sugaring, my relationship with the wife has improved out of sight. Once you get what you are missing from your life elsewhere it is easier to overlook the shortcomings at home, and see your wife in a more positive light.

I never thought of looking at it like this.

 

[UnicornHunter]

That's only if the wife doesn't have a serious issue with the situation... very rare that is the case.

 

[IchigoDave]

Maybe both parties are getting intimacy on the side. Just goes to show that sex is not always love.

 

[Frenchy]

Just goes to show that sex is not always love.

Yeah, nor marriage ...
but especially in Japan it looks like they have a knack to make it miserable . Like it HAS to be unsatisfying and “gaman” (efforts), otherwise it’s a bit weird. That’s what I never understood here.

 

[IchigoDave]

Yeah, nor marriage ...
but especially in Japan it looks like they have a knack to make it miserable . Like it HAS to be unsatisfying and “gaman” (efforts), otherwise it’s a bit weird. That’s what I never understood here.

Almost as if marriage is defined not by love, but by struggle.

 

[Frenchy]

Almost as if marriage is defined not by love, but by struggle.

Exactly. Heck they do not even try to pretend otherwise, have you seen wedding pics in Japan, with the families in the background ? All dressing black and not smiling ? And the excruciatingly boring and long and formal (and expensive) wedding lunches with the bosses making speaches about how a great worker the husband is ?

 

[Rusty Trombone]

May not work for everyone, but it sure kept my marriage together.

For a while I was pretty sure my wife was getting action elsewhere, but now not so sure.

She's hitting menopause and hormones are all over the place.

 

[SoapFTW]

So sorry to read this bro. I myself just got out of a sexless marriage that started after kids. We shared money though but she didn’t control it, I did what I wanted but she didn’t know about P4P and I didn’t tell her, though if she found out I would have happily owned it. We are both in USA though so I know things are different in Japan.

Your story scares the shit out of me ever wanting to marry a Japanese woman there, or have kids with one.

I know it’s very hard with kids but my only advice would be to pull the trigger sooner than later. You’ll never get this time of your life back. And you’ll be shocked at how much money you have when your money is 100% yours (other than child support or alimony).

And you don’t sound fat for your height. Don’t let her pull that shit. I’m a bit taller than you and 40 pounds heavier than you. I do lift a lot of weights so I have muscle but still chubby too. I’m trying to get to your weight now, but women still find me attractive and it’s not a problem if you are confident and just own it.

Anyway, best of luck to you getting out of this. I know your kids are important but your life is waiting for you...

Better to see them less but have really quality time than sacrifice all of your happiness to be with them all the time but be miserable.

And if you want a little more inspiration, how about this statistic: Some marriages are great and kudos to those people, however many are not great. I’ve NEVER met a guy who got divorced who regretted it. In fact, I’ve never even heard of one. Their only regrets is that they didn’t do it sooner... Think about that for a minute.

@Merica thanks for the encouragement. My dad has been pretty much begging me to get out of this marriage for the past 2 years too.

Due to my wife's extreme frugality, shall we say, we've been able to save quite a lot of money for a couple our age (I'll be turning 34 this week, she's 8 months older than me). She has managed out finances well, if not a bit stingily. However, I was thinking that once both kids are in school, or at least kindergarten, she could go back to work semi-full time, and then we could each take care of our own money again. When I suggested this, she broke down in utter hysteria again saying I would ruin all HER hard work, and basically no matter where the money comes from she's in charge. It's so fucking emasculating, but it's like I'm just trying to choose my battles all the time, i.e. keep the peace with her and battle my own internal frustrations, or fight for myself against her insanity which she can't even control in front of the kids and is clearly affecting them. Those are my 2 options, really, so I usually choose #1 just to protect the kids from her explosions.

 

[SoapFTW]

If she told you these things up front I think it would be justified to tell her then that you'll be happy to be just another member of the family as before but also look for occasional companionship that doesn't feel bad seen walking with you.

The numbers you gave will make your BMI to be below 30 which still doesn't even get the doctors unhappy with you. And the girls care even less, I have been told by several Japanese girls they don't mind a bit of soft buffer when fucking really hard.

I've been told the same thing. I know I'm no Dwayne Johnson, but I'm also no Meatloaf. I'd like to get in better shape, and I am putting effort in. The thing is, I worked really hard last year to get in decent shape, and I was down to about 85kg, but nothing changed. So with no real chances of meeting someone else or even having time to hang out once I've found someone, I kind of lose motivation.

 

[Frenchy]

@Merica thanks for the encouragement. My dad has been pretty much begging me to get out of this marriage for the past 2 years too.

Due to my wife's extreme frugality, shall we say, we've been able to save quite a lot of money for a couple our age (I'll be turning 34 this week, she's 8 months older than me). She has managed out finances well, if not a bit stingily. However, I was thinking that once both kids are in school, or at least kindergarten, she could go back to work semi-full time, and then we could each take care of our own money again. When I suggested this, she broke down in utter hysteria again saying I would ruin all HER hard work, and basically no matter where the money comes from she's in charge. It's so fucking emasculating, but it's like I'm just trying to choose my battles all the time, i.e. keep the peace with her and battle my own internal frustrations, or fight for myself against her insanity which she can't even control in front of the kids and is clearly affecting them. Those are my 2 options, really, so I usually choose #1 just to protect the kids from her explosions.

stupid question probably but why did you accept that situation in the first place? Just “in Rome do as Romans do”? Did you try to tell her at the beginning that would not work for you?

 

[SoapFTW]

Aww bless you, that doesn’t sound enjoyable at all. Maybe in the meantime you can come to some sort of platonic “family” agreement, where you both put in and equally share the load but still have your own independence while remaining loyal to the family unit. This stance might be a bit too progressive for the typical J mindset but it might be worth a try if it means you can achieve a bit more happiness and independence. Good luck

Yeah thanks for the advice and encouragement. She's been quite spoiled, I think, at least compared to her Japanese friends. All their husbands go out after work, come home super late, and the wives literally do everything at home. I come straight home, help with the kids, dinner, dishes, baths, bedtime, all of it. Then she freaks out when I ask for a night out every month or 2 to see a mate. So, I doubt she'd be ok with me wanting more independence. I suppose I could just lie and say I have to work late.

That’s a very cruel thing to say. I’ve dated someone bigger than you and he was the sweetest person who helped me go through my past trauma and made me the happiest person. I’m not saying this for moral signaling, well maybe I am a bit moral signaling but we would constantly get unsolicited comments or advice from supposed friends, outsiders etc. about his weight or how our bodies looked different and I’d always be very quick to shut them off. If you love someone, you should stand by them and shield them from judgement. A fat guy with a golden heart wins over a self absorbed dead beat boyfriend with a six pack anytime and fat shaming is disgusting.

God. Is it so hard to open the door with a big smile and say “welcome home honey, how was work today? Thank you for everything you do for us.”

Damn straight!

I rarely refer to women as "bitches". Your wife's apparently entitled to that epithet.

Good luck in extricating yourself from the situation.

Cheers! Gotta find the right way and time for it.

@SoapFTW
Feel for you bro, but I dare say quite a few blokes on here have been thru very similar circumstances. Most have come out the other side at least a bit happier, either thru separation or other means.
It's weird but since I started sugaring, my relationship with the wife has improved out of sight. Once you get what you are missing from your life elsewhere it is easier to overlook the shortcomings at home, and see your wife in a more positive light. I'm not sure if that is across the board but it is what happened for me.
However the fat shaming (and I'm sure I'm bigger than you) is not something I could live with. My wife sometimes mentions my weight, but it is more of a "you should lose some to be healthier" vibe.

If you can't afford the sugar bowl then why not try and get a FWB. The 2 I've had in the last 12 months like having a meal, and heading to a LH. Very light hearted, and just good fun. One is 25, the other is 37. Both are hot and have good banter.

My wife has said the same thing about my weight before, but the gloves came off the other night and her true feelings were exposed.

I don't really have a large social circle, for reasons explained above, so finding a FWB would be a bit hard. Where did you find yours?

 

[SoapFTW]

stupid question probably but why did you accept that situation in the first place? Just “in Rome do as Romans do”? Did you try to tell her at the beginning that would not work for you?

Nope, not a stupid question at all. It was definitely part "When in Rome...", but also I didn't think she would be as controlling as she turned out to be. Then, whenever I've tried to change things, literally within seconds of bringing it up she completely breaks down into utter hysteria. She is a complete narcissist. Not in the way many people understand it to be, as in she's vain. Not like that. She sees the world through entirely self-serving emotions with a complete lack of logic or objective thinking, making her reality completely different to the actual reality, and any perspective other than her own cannot be explained to her or penetrate the wall of emotional hysteria blocking it. One of my mates from back home is going through a nasty divorce with his wife who I've found out is very similar to mine, and he has given me lots of resources to read up on, and my wife fits the textbook description of a narcissist.

 

[SoapFTW]

So, what sort of budget do you guys have for sugaring? Where do you find them? Just on Seeking Dot Com? How about FWB? A lot of people talk about these, but I've no idea where to even start looking for one! My social circle and social activities are very limited.

There are a few Hubs (pubs) near where I work, and I occasionally go there for happy hour, but due to the time there usually aren't many options there, and the few women who are there are usually with another guy already or in a group.

 

[Frenchy]

Nope, not a stupid question at all. It was definitely part "When in Rome...", but also I didn't think she would be as controlling as she turned out to be. Then, whenever I've tried to change things, literally within seconds of bringing it up she completely breaks down into utter hysteria. She is a complete narcissist. Not in the way many people understand it to be, as in she's vain. Not like that. She sees the world through entirely self-serving emotions with a complete lack of logic or objective thinking, making her reality completely different to the actual reality, and any perspective other than her own cannot be explained to her or penetrate the wall of emotional hysteria blocking it. One of my mates from back home is going through a nasty divorce with his wife who I've found out is very similar to mine, and he has given me lots of resources to read up on, and my wife fits the textbook description of a narcissist.

I can see the type... although tbh mine was not that extreme (and I’m no angel either). You can have fun on the side and grind it until kids are older, do stuff like yoga or martial art or anything that can distract you from her (not just sex). But I hope she’s not poisoning the kids too with such narc tendencies

 

[SoapFTW]

I can see the type... although tbh mine was not that extreme (and I’m no angel either). You can have fun on the side and grind it until kids are older, do stuff like yoga or martial art or anything that can distract you from her (not just sex). But I hope she’s not poisoning the kids too with such narc tendencies

That's really what I've resigned myself to. Just trying to find other things in life to find happiness and fulfilment in, like my kids. The interesting thing is that my 4 year old son is so well behaved with me, but as soon as his mother is around he changes.

 

[MikeH]

I kind of lose motivation.

Being in shape doesn't mean that much in finding girls but staying healthy is good for you overall and makes you be able to do more things and longer when you find that girl.

And remember the long game, you need to be there for your kids. Even if that means outliving that bitch.

 

[SoapFTW]

Being in shape doesn't mean that much in finding girls but staying healthy is good for you overall and makes you be able to do more things and longer when you find that girl.

And remember the long game, you need to be there for your kids. Even if that means outliving that bitch.

I do believe you make a very good point!

 

[Frenchy]

So, what sort of budget do you guys have for sugaring? Where do you find them? Just on Seeking Dot Com? How about FWB? A lot of people talk about these, but I've no idea where to even start looking for one! My social circle and social activities are very limited.
.

my current budget is about 300k a month on average (Cash + extras) spent on 4 ladies.

Since I started this I had about 20 SBs , sometimes just for one date, often much longer. Most of them found on Seeking but 2 whom I met as escorts first.

Ex-GF is now a FWB (kinda/ sort of) but we meet very rarely as we are thousands of miles apart.

I would be wary of trying to find “Real” FWBs as I don’t think my... ahem.... benefits are good enough for that. But hearing Mikey and others’ stories it seems that some wives (not yours, others ) are relatively easy targets if they’re into foreigners

 

[Rusty Trombone]

I don't really have a large social circle, for reasons explained above, so finding a FWB would be a bit hard. Where did you find yours?

The 37 year old is an ex-student of mine from the early 2000s
The 25 year old I met on a trip to Kyushu. She was working in a kyaba and we just hit it off. Only started banging her a couple of months later, but seen her a few times since.

Only meet both every few months as I like staying and spending my money on the SB in Tokyo.

 

[MikeH]

But hearing Mikey and others’ stories it seems that some wives (not yours, others ) are relatively easy targets if they’re into foreigners

Relatively easy is very relative.

At least for me nothing has been easy, but when you try long enough good things are bound to happen.

There might not be that high percentage of girls who are in to old foreigners who dress like hobos but then again you only need three.

 

[SoapFTW]

my current budget is about 300k a month on average (Cash + extras) spent on 4 ladies.

Since I started this I had about 20 SBs , sometimes just for one date, often much longer. Most of them found on Seeking but 2 whom I met as escorts first.

Ex-GF is now a FWB (kinda/ sort of) but we meet very rarely as we are thousands of miles apart.

I would be wary of trying to find “Real” FWBs as I don’t think my... ahem.... benefits are good enough for that. But hearing Mikey and others’ stories it seems that some wives (not yours, others ) are relatively easy targets if they’re into foreigners

Hahaha! I don't think my benefits would be anything particularly stellar either. I guess I have to find someone with low expectations!

That's a fair bit of dough, at least for me. I could probably get by on 70k per month, at least as long as I can get money from Japan to overseas and back to Japan again! I guess FWB would be a better option than paid sugaring.

The 37 year old is an ex-student of mine from the early 2000s
The 25 year old I met on a trip to Kyushu. She was working in a kyaba and we just hit it off. Only started banging her a couple of months later, but seen her a few times since.

Only meet both every few months as I like staying and spending my money on the SB in Tokyo.

Ah, the old ex-student! That's an awesome idea... I still have a whole bunch of them on my FB from years gone by teaching in AUS, CAN and JPN, so maybe I should try setting something up.

 

[Merica]

God. Is it so hard to open the door with a big smile and say “welcome home honey, how was work today? Thank you for everything you do for us.”

Apparently it is. I rarely if ever got a welcome like this coming home. I doubt any of my married guy friends have either. We talk about it, it fucking sucks when it gets to that point.

The amount of compliments a man gets is probably like 1/1000th of what a woman gets. I’ve seen it the same everywhere in the world I’ve been to so far.

I’d venture to say only about 10% of women would even think the way you do so kudos for being a rare breed who understands what guys go through.

Sure if they are trying to get married and lock you down it’s all sunshine and roses. After marriage (or even long term relationship that’s gone stale), good luck ever hearing anything like that.

Thus, we stay single. And happy. Or at least content...

 

[Merica]

I've been told the same thing. I know I'm no Dwayne Johnson, but I'm also no Meatloaf. I'd like to get in better shape, and I am putting effort in. The thing is, I worked really hard last year to get in decent shape, and I was down to about 85kg, but nothing changed. So with no real chances of meeting someone else or even having time to hang out once I've found someone, I kind of lose motivation.

This happened with me too. A few years ago I was a trim 215 lbs (for a 6’4” big framed guy) and in great shape and wife still didn’t want to fuck. I had a ton of attention from other women but I was faithful and tried to make it work with my wife. It didn’t.

That all made me realize it wasn’t about bodies at all. That was an easy excuse. It was mental/emotional/psychological.

You are now “the provider”. You will not be sexy to her anymore. If I were you (and I have been you) I’d cut my losses and end it ASAP. But if you stick around, please, please, please grab your balls and stop letting her control you, your money, your time and what you can and can’t do (what is she your mother?). Fuck that noise brother.

Really trying to give you some tough love here. The way to things getting better isn’t by appeasing her bullshit, it’s by putting your foot down and being 100% prepared to leave if she doesn’t agree to work together on the issues that bother you (and vice versa). There’s no other way...

 

[SoapFTW]

This happened with me too. A few years ago I was a trim 215 lbs (for a 6’4” big framed guy) and in great shape and wife still didn’t want to fuck. I had a ton of attention from other women but I was faithful and tried to make it work with my wife. It didn’t.

That all made me realize it wasn’t about bodies at all. That was an easy excuse. It was mental/emotional/psychological.

You are now “the provider”. You will not be sexy to her anymore. If I were you (and I have been you) I’d cut my losses and end it ASAP. But if you stick around, please, please, please grab your balls and stop letting her control you, your money, your time and what you can and can’t do (what is she your mother?). Fuck that noise brother.

Really trying to give you some tough love here. The way to things getting better isn’t by appeasing her bullshit, it’s by putting your foot down and being 100% prepared to leave if she doesn’t agree to work together on the issues that bother you (and vice versa). There’s no other way...

Tough love for sure, but on point too. I do actually have a plan in place that depends on upcoming changes to certain work circumstances, country of domicile, and my best understanding of The Hague Convention, which should all come together within the next 9 to 10 months, at which point it'll be Sayonara Horrendous Marriage, and Hello Freedom.

 

[Merica]

Tough love for sure, but on point too. I do actually have a plan in place that depends on upcoming changes to certain work circumstances, country of domicile, and my best understanding of The Hague Convention, which should all come together within the next 9 to 10 months, at which point it'll be Sayonara Horrendous Marriage, and Hello Freedom.

Best of luck to you. Life’s great on the other side.