The Next US President is....

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Obama seems to have disappeared these days. Anyway, he was one of the key reasons for Trump’s victory. He had so much good will directed towards him but achieved the least of any post-war President. So, his endorsement of Mrs. Clinton backfired.

A good assessment of Obama’s legacy is contained in the link below. The Independent is a VERY liberal newspaper so it illustrates what a disgrace he was as a President.

https://www.google.co.jp/amp/s/www.independent.co.uk/voices/barack-obama-peace-prize-syria-chemical-weapons-bashar-al-assad-jimmy-carter-legacy-a7684661.html?amp

Well, the one thing Obama definitely achieved was to antagonize and enrage the entire Rust Belt and more white, working-class voters than any other president in history. His pompous remarks directed toward church-going families, gun owners and particularly military and first responders, combined with his special brand of elitist, academic arrogance and lack of any real accomplishments drove away voters in all the wrong states. Add to that a fundamentally flawed and disliked candidate like Hillary Clinton and the Democratic Party basically rolled out the red carpet for Trump.

History will remember Barack Obama as probably the most useless president after, say, Jimmy Carter, but there's one successful title he earned that he may not like: the greatest gift to the American gun industry since the British Parliament came up with the Tea Act in 1773.
 
Well, the one thing Obama definitely achieved was to antagonize and enrage the entire Rust Belt and more white, working-class voters than any other president in history. His pompous remarks directed toward church-going families, gun owners and particularly military and first responders, combined with his special brand of elitist, academic arrogance and lack of any real accomplishments drove away voters in all the wrong states. Add to that a fundamentally flawed and disliked candidate like Hillary Clinton and the Democratic Party basically rolled out the red carpet for Trump.

History will remember Barack Obama as probably the most useless president after, say, Jimmy Carter, but there's one successful title he earned that he may not like: the greatest gift to the American gun industry since the British Parliament came up with the Tea Act in 1773.

He was probably not as great as many say he was, granted, but I fail to see how he could be considered worse than George W Bush, who on his watch let the subprime bubble grow and explode , and went to war against Irak despite no evidence of WMD, nor support of Al Qaida etc and whose mess later gave birth to ISIS. Sorry, I just can’t.
 
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He was probably not as great as many say he was, granted, but I fail to see how he could be considered worse than George W Bush, who on his watch let the subprime bubble grow and explode , and went to war against Irak despite no evidence of WMD, nor support of Al Qaida etc and whose mess later gave birth to ISIS. Sorry, I just can’t.
Obama was ineffective. W was a dangerous ideolog. I'll take Obama anyday. The President who kills the fewest people gets my vote. So far Trump hasnt killed too many. He just makes them sleep outside, seperates them from their families, makes them pay more for Chinese plastic shit at Walmart that nobody really needs, etc.etc., but he hasnt killed that many.....yet anyway.
 
Obama was ineffective. W was a dangerous ideolog. I'll take Obama anyday. The President who kills the fewest people gets my vote. So far Trump hasnt killed too many. He just makes them sleep outside, seperates them from their families, makes them pay more for Chinese plastic shit at Walmart that nobody really needs, etc.etc., but he hasnt killed that many.....yet anyway.
True! We can at least grant him that
 
He was probably not as great as many say he was, granted, but I fail to see how he could be considered worse than George W Bush, who on his watch let the subprime bubble grow and explode , and went to war against Irak despite no evidence of WMD, nor support of Al Qaida etc and whose mess later gave birth to ISIS. Sorry, I just can’t.

I don't know that I'd pose it as a question of which was better, BO or GWB, because I think they were very different types of leaders thrust into very different types of presidencies. I do think history is going to partially vindicate Bush, while basically discarding Obama.

Bush got elected by his father's political machine and was just supposed to sit there as a token president in the Bush Family Legacy. Unfortunately, he happened to be sitting in the Oval Office when two major events occurred that changed American history--9/11 and then, of course, the market crash. To be fair, there really isn't any effective training for dealing with largely unprecedented events. And the Bush White House was, ultimately, controlled by the Cheney/Rumsfeld group as well as his family's business interests.

All things considered, I think Bush handled our response to 9/11 as well as he could have and even today the public agrees. Was Iraq a great idea? No, but it wasn't really Bush's idea. But it was a big idea, and we ended up learning a very valuable lesson from it on when, why and how we should invade countries. Our fuck up in Iraq may ultimately prevent us from trying the same thing with Iran, and if that's the case then I'd have to say it was somewhat worthwhile because, as history has shown, Iraq didn't really have any WMDs but Iran sure as shit does. And nobody had ever experienced what allowing banks to exploit sub-prime loans on such a massive scale could do, so again, a royal fuck up but we learned from it. Our banking systems now have a bit more oversight and regulations are smarter.

Obama was a guy who got to the U.S. Senate by basically being in the right place at the right time. He had absolutely zero executive, administrative or leadership experience and zero business trying to become leader of the free world. But Obama, again, was in the right place at the right time, and he became president for three simple reasons: 1) He gave a good speech, 2) He wasn't George Bush and 3) He was black. And his presidency, unlike that of GWB, was more or less very uneventful. He really wasn't given any big opportunities to fuck up like GWB had. He simply sat there looking and sounding cool while the economy eventually recovered (at the slowest recovery pace in American history), as the existing Bush military strategy was left in place and dealt with resolving our fuck ups in the Middle East (although he campaigned against those strategies and vowed to end them...but never did). I mean, what big events happened in his 8 years? A couple of black kids got shot and he used the opportunity to rile up race tensions and piss off White America. Then Bin Laden got smoked...using the same military apparatus, technology and techniques Obama vowed to end but was perfectly happy to take credit for later. I mean, Benghazi was the biggest geopolitical event of all and he was more than happy to throw Hillary under the bus for that one.

I would have to say that had Obama been put through the same challenges as Bush, given the team Obama surrounded himself with and the political dogma he followed, I believe he would've screwed up far worse than Bush. But we'll never really know. But in fifty years, GWB will be remembered as the president who saw us through 9/11, while BO while be "Who? Oh, that black guy."

And liberals will still be crying about Trump.
 
History will remember Barack Obama as probably the most useless president after, say, Jimmy Carter.

Carter has dedicated his life to serving his country and deserves respect for that. For Obama being President was just another job - he never had the same sense of service and that’s why he was a flop.
 
Any Pocahontas fans out there? Will she be able to the climb the greasy pole and become President?
 
I
I don't know that I'd pose it as a question of which was better, BO or GWB, because I think they were very different types of leaders thrust into very different types of presidencies. I do think history is going to partially vindicate Bush, while basically discarding Obama.

Bush got elected by his father's political machine and was just supposed to sit there as a token president in the Bush Family Legacy. Unfortunately, he happened to be sitting in the Oval Office when two major events occurred that changed American history--9/11 and then, of course, the market crash. To be fair, there really isn't any effective training for dealing with largely unprecedented events. And the Bush White House was, ultimately, controlled by the Cheney/Rumsfeld group as well as his family's business interests.

All things considered, I think Bush handled our response to 9/11 as well as he could have and even today the public agrees. Was Iraq a great idea? No, but it wasn't really Bush's idea. But it was a big idea, and we ended up learning a very valuable lesson from it on when, why and how we should invade countries. Our fuck up in Iraq may ultimately prevent us from trying the same thing with Iran, and if that's the case then I'd have to say it was somewhat worthwhile because, as history has shown, Iraq didn't really have any WMDs but Iran sure as shit does. And nobody had ever experienced what allowing banks to exploit sub-prime loans on such a massive scale could do, so again, a royal fuck up but we learned from it. Our banking systems now have a bit more oversight and regulations are smarter.

Obama was a guy who got to the U.S. Senate by basically being in the right place at the right time. He had absolutely zero executive, administrative or leadership experience and zero business trying to become leader of the free world. But Obama, again, was in the right place at the right time, and he became president for three simple reasons: 1) He gave a good speech, 2) He wasn't George Bush and 3) He was black. And his presidency, unlike that of GWB, was more or less very uneventful. He really wasn't given any big opportunities to fuck up like GWB had. He simply sat there looking and sounding cool while the economy eventually recovered (at the slowest recovery pace in American history), as the existing Bush military strategy was left in place and dealt with resolving our fuck ups in the Middle East (although he campaigned against those strategies and vowed to end them...but never did). I mean, what big events happened in his 8 years? A couple of black kids got shot and he used the opportunity to rile up race tensions and piss off White America. Then Bin Laden got smoked...using the same military apparatus, technology and techniques Obama vowed to end but was perfectly happy to take credit for later. I mean, Benghazi was the biggest geopolitical event of all and he was more than happy to throw Hillary under the bus for that one.

I would have to say that had Obama been put through the same challenges as Bush, given the team Obama surrounded himself with and the political dogma he followed, I believe he would've screwed up far worse than Bush. But we'll never really know. But in fifty years, GWB will be remembered as the president who saw us through 9/11, while BO while be "Who? Oh, that black guy."

And liberals will still be crying about Trump.

It was all Rummy. He usurped command and control and took us to war. He made over $500mil from his position in Halliburton as a consequence....

I don’t think Bush will be remembered as ‘the guy who got us through 9/11’. Giuliani was the guy in the limelight at the time. Too bad he’s recently screwed up what would have been a great legacy. Bush will be remembered for being a bumbling idiot - portrayed brilliantly by Will Farrell.

In so far as Big City Liberals and college professors are the ones who write history, Obama will be remembered as the young, black, charismatic President who actually cared about people and tried but failed to bring decency and ‘compromise for the greater good’ into our government. By the time his term is being written about as history, the US will be that much further down the road to becoming a Corporate State. Government will be completely outsourced to a few large corporations: Fedex and Halliburton, maybe. Education, healthcare and other services will be 100 percent private and mostly unaffordable, income and wealth disparity will be on par with Columbia, and the rich folks will have to live in guarded communities and drive in armored vehicles. Blacked out windows up to gaurd from thrown rocks and to keep out the toxic pollution and heat. Obama will be remembered as the last decent man we ever had as a President. Might be.
 
Carter has dedicated his life to serving his country and deserves respect for that. For Obama being President was just another job - he never had the same sense of service and that’s why he was a flop.

Oh, I agree with that completely. I was speaking in terms of success as a president. What Jimmy Carter has achieved post-presidency is nothing short of amazing, and he has proven to be one of the most effective global ambassadors our country has ever had. As a president, however, his administration was largely ineffective and useless and he deserved to lose to Reagan...which Carter has very graciously been willing to admit on record. Obama just wanted to fuel his ego, same goes for Trump.

I've only ever met one sitting POTUS (and I'm not going to name which one) but I've always been fascinated in reading personal accounts of people who worked closely with past presidents. I've chatted with former members of Congress, read books by speechwriters and campaign directors, and they all seem to tell a similar story about the individual politicians.

Carter: A typical genteel southerner, a modest and kind old man.

Reagan: Larger than life in public, very closed-off in private. Wife ran the show. Had no male friends. Very distant person.

Bush SR: The grandfather you wish you had. Kind, caring, strict but never judgmental. Many pundits believe if Perot had fucked off and SR got a second term, he may have been remembered as one of the best in history.

Bill Clinton: Absolute fucking fun (if you're a guy). A shameless pervert and sexual predator (if you're a woman). Likes good looking women and good food, nothing more. The most chaotic White House environment anyone can remember. Staff hated working there.

GWB: One of the kindest, most personable presidents anyone can remember. Took care of his staffers as if they were his kids. Plagued constantly by oppressive role of Cheney and the Bush Machine and the many demands made of him.

Obama: A snide, arrogant, self-important and self-obsessed elitist. Loved to micro-manage everything.

TRUMP: What you see is what you get.

If I could meet one living president, it would be GWB. For better or worse, he was the president I became an adult under and the president I was willing to go to war under. And I've respected everything he's done since leaving the White House. Seems like a genuinely good guy.

If only he was still a drinking man that'd be a fucking date made in heaven.
 
I


It was all Rummy. He usurped command and control and took us to war. He made over $500mil from his position in Halliburton as a consequence....

I don’t think Bush will be remembered as ‘the guy who got us through 9/11’. Giuliani was the guy in the limelight at the time. Too bad he’s recently screwed up what would have been a great legacy. Bush will be remembered for being a bumbling idiot - portrayed brilliantly by Will Farrell.

In so far as Big City Liberals and college professors are the ones who write history, Obama will be remembered as the young, black, charismatic President who actually cared about people and tried but failed to bring decency and ‘compromise for the greater good’ into our government. By the time his term is being written about as history, the US will be that much further down the road to becoming a Corporate State. Government will be completely outsourced to a few large corporations: Fedex and Halliburton, maybe. Education, healthcare and other services will be 100 percent private and mostly unaffordable, income and wealth disparity will be on par with Columbia, and the rich folks will have to live in guarded communities and drive in armored vehicles. Blacked out windows up to gaurd from thrown rocks and to keep out the toxic pollution and heat. Obama will be remembered as the last decent man we ever had as a President. Might be.

Hate to be the bad guy but that scenario sounds like 1) an awesome movie script, and 2) a very fruitful opportunity for P4P. Assuming I'm one of the rich, obviously. If not, I'm pretty good at throwing rocks and drinking in the streets.
 
Hate to be the bad guy but that scenario sounds like 1) an awesome movie script, and 2) a very fruitful opportunity for P4P. Assuming I'm one of the rich, obviously. If not, I'm pretty good at throwing rocks and drinking in the streets.

I may be a jaded cynical European but I think our leaders are not that powerful anyway. Except for the 10 or so who can blow the planet with nukes but it’s a rather useless power if you think that, well, we all live on this planet.
Technological, demographic, economic trends are way more important in the long run and mostly out of their control.
Look at the most autocratic, bloodthirsty, all-powerful dictators like Hitler, Staline, Mao. None of them could prevent their countries to end up very differently from what they had planned... so the temporarily elected, constitutionally controlled guys like Trump, Macron, Merkel,Abe etc... forget it. In the grand scheme of things they don’t mean that much. All we can hope is that they keep the world relatively at peace and don’t screw up too much.
 
Hate to be the bad guy but that scenario sounds like 1) an awesome movie script, and 2) a very fruitful opportunity for P4P. Assuming I'm one of the rich, obviously. If not, I'm pretty good at throwing rocks and drinking in the streets.
There is a place for everyone. Even you.
 
I may be a jaded cynical European but I think our leaders are not that powerful anyway. Except for the 10 or so who can blow the planet with nukes but it’s a rather useless power if you think that, well, we all live on this planet.
Technological, demographic, economic trends are way more important in the long run and mostly out of their control.
Look at the most autocratic, bloodthirsty, all-powerful dictators like Hitler, Staline, Mao. None of them could prevent their countries to end up very differently from what they had planned... so the temporarily elected, constitutionally controlled guys like Trump, Macron, Merkel,Abe etc... forget it. In the grand scheme of things they don’t mean that much. All we can hope is that they keep the world relatively at peace and don’t screw up too much.
The socialist ideologues did a lot of damage. We should try to avoid that happening again. Mao, Stalin etc.
 
Batty old Pocahontas v’s Crazy Trump should make for entertaining Presidenti debates.
 
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Batty old Pocahontas v’s Crazy Trump should make for entertaining Presidenti debates.

You have no idea how badly I want to see that debate. That is going to be absolute comic fucking gold. I mean, watching Trump destroy Jeb Bush on primetime television was funny as shit, but what he'll do to Pocahontas on stage is going to make history. Warren does pretty well on camera, but stupid commie hag has no clue what she's getting herself into.

Difference is, last time I was furious at Trump for knocking out my preferred candidate so I couldn't fully enjoy the debates. This time, I'll know his electoral victory is in the bag so why bother getting mad? Just make some popcorn and some stiff drinks and enjoy the entertainment.
 
It seems everyone else thinks it actually makes a difference who is the president. My tiny brain thinks if a democrat wins then it's the democratic machine that decides what the president does, if a republican wins then the republican machine.

The president of any country has more power than our beloved emperor, but not much. The president of United States can tweet whatever he wants and select his own socks in the morning, while the emperor's socks are selected to him by the imperial household agency. But that's about all the difference there is.

And as said, I will start caring who is the president of USA only if it starts to affect the love hotel prices in greater Tokyo area. Or any of their daughters promises to give me a blowjob. Until that happens I will not vote in their elections. That's a promise.
 
It seems everyone else thinks it actually makes a difference who is the president. My tiny brain thinks if a democrat wins then it's the democratic machine that decides what the president does, if a republican wins then the republican machine.

The president of any country has more power than our beloved emperor, but not much. The president of United States can tweet whatever he wants and select his own socks in the morning, while the emperor's socks are selected to him by the imperial household agency. But that's about all the difference there is.

And as said, I will start caring who is the president of USA only if it starts to affect the love hotel prices in greater Tokyo area. Or any of their daughters promises to give me a blowjob. Until that happens I will not vote in their elections. That's a promise.

Just like when people tell you to vote and that your vote matters. If it really truly mattered, they would get rid of the electoral college votes. They repeat it over and over again until it's brainwashed into people's mind that voting really matters.

Here is a video that explains it a lot better. Not about voting, but same concept applies.
 
Just like when people tell you to vote and that your vote matters. If it really truly mattered, they would get rid of the electoral college votes. They repeat it over and over again until it's brainwashed into people's mind that voting really matters.

Here is a video that explains it a lot better. Not about voting, but same concept applies.


Well it does matter. You still want to avoid the complete nutjobs who would screw things up. But not hoping too much from the guys you vote for , like they are some kind of messiah or prophet. They do a job, they don’t do miracles.
 
You have no idea how badly I want to see that debate. That is going to be absolute comic fucking gold. I mean, watching Trump destroy Jeb Bush on primetime television was funny as shit, but what he'll do to Pocahontas on stage is going to make history. Warren does pretty well on camera, but stupid commie hag has no clue what she's getting herself into.

Difference is, last time I was furious at Trump for knocking out my preferred candidate so I couldn't fully enjoy the debates. This time, I'll know his electoral victory is in the bag so why bother getting mad? Just make some popcorn and some stiff drinks and enjoy the entertainment.

I disagree, Warren seems intelligent and principled- i liked her anhiliation of the Wells Fargo CEO.

However, does it matter? You sound like you know a lot about this subject so this is a genuine question; what % of voters actually change their mind based on a candidate’s performance in a debate? Im guessing 30 years ago when there was (relitavely) rational intelligent debate it couldve been 5-10%, but now? When do people ever change their mind about anything nowadays?
 
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