Completely Useless or Confusing Things in Tokyo

[Ken1988]

But 38.7% of Americans, my fellow countrymen, believe that the US Constitution requires everyone in the world to speak and listen to them in English!!

-Ww

Ah, here's timely news.
https://www.huffingtonpost.com/entr...guy-speak-spanish_us_5afc6070e4b0779345d523fd

 

[AMcguyver]

Completely Useless or Confusing Things in Tokyo -

Touts.

 

[Sudsy]

Completely Useless or Confusing Things in Tokyo -

Touts.

Thery're not COMPLETELY useless.

They provide us with a common enemy, and make allies of unlikely bedfellows, so to speak.

 

[ShowaJidai]

Americans, my fellow countrymen, believe that the US Constitution requires everyone in the world to speak and listen to them in English!!

-Ww

Most Americans see foreign countries as something like some TV show they have watched occasionally. They know who the main characters are and the basic story line - but it's not reality.

 

[Wwanderer]

Ah, here's timely news.
https://www.huffingtonpost.com/entr...guy-speak-spanish_us_5afc6070e4b0779345d523fd

Wow, the fit to my post couldn't be any more perfect. Thanks for posting it; people might have thought I was exaggerating otherwise.

-Ww

 

[Sudsy]

Ah, here's timely news.
https://www.huffingtonpost.com/entr...guy-speak-spanish_us_5afc6070e4b0779345d523fd

Hoist by his own petard.

This pleases me.

For those who don't understand the origin of the phrase.....

 

[rob040188]

Hoist by his own petard.

This pleases me.

For those who don't understand the origin of the phrase.....

That's cool. the above pic explains "shaped charges". Focused explosions to cut open objects (steel/doors/concrete/tank armor). I didn't know the french pioneered this. If I remember correctly it was the Germans or the Americans who discovered (or first wrote a white paper about it).

Then the Israeli's countered shaped charges (or at least minimized) the effects with ERA (Explosive Reactive Armor).

Maybe, i'm mis-remembering...

 

[TheScientist]

Most useless thing: weebs. Well... they can be bled for cash so theres some use.

Otherwise, late to this party so massive multi quote below

Then there are places where you can see three 7-11's at the same time. Anyone got a place for four?

Its actually strategic. The point is to lock out your competitors from that area by taking up available retail space. Used to know a guy who worked for a real estate management company who claimed that his boss was the one who thought of this strategy.

One trendy-used clothing place I am convinced must be run by the son of the building owner. Otherwise I doubt he could pay the rent even if he sold the entire inventory in a single month.

Well established tax dodge. By keeping the useless store open the building/business owner gets big write-offs.

Particularly in business and professional meetings most Japanese prefer to speak office slang.

Imo, the way most Japanese speak Japanese in any particular situation is the way Japanese is properly spoken in that situation by definition.

I'm gonna go with @ShowaJidai on this one. I have been witness to many inter department meetings where each department is speaking their own slang and the other doesnt understand it. Or where vendors speak their slang to customers who dont understand it and vice versa.

native speakers I know complain that keigo gets in the way of clear and efficient communication (usually younger people) while others (older people generally, and when I say "old" I mean OLD) say that it allows one to be clear and efficient.

The difference I've observed is that the older folks generally actually know how to speak correct keigo. The younger ones (and this now includes middle aged office workers) speak a really mangled keigo. Call center people speak a kind of keigo that just takes up too much time for the listener of any age.

you could argue that katakana, rather than original language spelling in roman letters, is uselsss and confusing most of the time.

What I love is when native Japanese speakers insist that katakana captures the true pronunciation of the loan word!

Why do people not understand me if i say イロンマン instead of イオンマン？

I come from the country that created that character and I wouldn't know what the fuck you were talking about if you pronounced it your way.

Most Americans see foreign countries as something like some TV show they have watched occasionally. They know who the main characters are and the basic story line - but it's not reality.

Same applies to the British, French, German, Italian, Russian, Chinese, Thai, Vietnamese, Indian, etc. etc. etc. etc. etc.

 

[Frenchy]

Most useless thing: weebs. Well... they can be bled for cash so theres some use.

Otherwise, late to this party so massive multi quote below



Its actually strategic. The point is to lock out your competitors from that area by taking up available retail space. Used to know a guy who worked for a real estate management company who claimed that his boss was the one who thought of this strategy.



Well established tax dodge. By keeping the useless store open the building/business owner gets big write-offs.





I'm gonna go with @ShowaJidai

Same applies to the British, French, German, Italian, Russian, Chinese, Thai, Vietnamese, Indian, etc. etc. etc. etc. etc.

And the Japanese, for that matter. They are kings at stereotyping other countries, even more than the Americans imo. They love the DisneyWorld EPCOT fantasy version of each country .

As for the different slangs in different departments, it’s not specifically Japanese at all. Try to make IT guys and Legal guys talk together, in any country/industry.

 

[TheScientist]

Try to make IT guys and Legal guys talk together, in any country/industry.

Thats one of the things I do. Part of my weird and varied skill set. Thanks to those lunatic Eurocrats and GDPR, I forsee that skill being profitable for a while. Until it all blows up in Europes face but by then I will not only have laughed my way to the bank but will be able to afford a nice break to travel to Europe and laugh at the Eurocrats in person.

 

[ShowaJidai]

As for the different slangs in different departments, it’s not specifically Japanese at all. Try to make IT guys and Legal guys talk together, in any country/industry.

The point I was making is that Japanese - in my experience - do not use proper Japanese to express themselves in business settings.

An example - I used to work with an American manager who spoke proper business Japanese the way you would expect a professor of business to speak. Very often the few educated Japanese would have to translate what he was saying to the other Japanese in the meeting who didn't understand a phrase like "year-over-year monthly average" in Japanese. Most Japanese would just say the word for "average" and expect it to be understood what that average is.

Heck, many Japanese say "Hantai" (against, opposing) when they mean "Gyaku" (opposite).

 

[Frenchy]

Thats one of the things I do. Part of my weird and varied skill set. Thanks to those lunatic Eurocrats and GDPR, I forsee that skill being profitable for a while. Until it all blows up in Europes face but by then I will not only have laughed my way to the bank but will be able to afford a nice break to travel to Europe and laugh at the Eurocrats in person.

Yeah. Kinda think the same about the lunatic Yankees with FATCA

 

[Frenchy]

The point I was making is that Japanese - in my experience - do not use proper Japanese to express themselves in business settings.

An example - I used to work with an American manager who spoke proper business Japanese the way you would expect a professor of business to speak. Very often the few educated Japanese would have to translate what he was saying to the other Japanese in the meeting who didn't understand a phrase like "year-over-year monthly average" in Japanese. Most Japanese would just say the word for "average" and expect it to be understood what that average is.

Heck, many Japanese say "Hantai" (against, opposing) when they mean "Gyaku" (opposite).

Yeah, that or maybe your American manager spoke perfect Japanese but with an American accent

 

[Ken1988]

Heck, many Japanese say "Hantai" (against, opposing) when they mean "Gyaku" (opposite).

For me, the nuance of hantai would be more or less “counter” and that of gyaku would be “reverse”. Hantai is about positions whereas gyaku is about directions. As far as what they are talking about is a static object, the meaning is the same. On the direction of a moving object, gyaku alone can imply a reverse flow whereas hantai need to modify an appropriate noun (such as “houkou”) to make it the same meaning. I think the distinction is clear among the locals.

 

[MikeH]

Yeah, that or maybe your American manager spoke perfect Japanese but with an American accent

It's funny how it seems that for everyone with English as mother tongue it seems to be almost impossible to pronounce Japanese well. This far I have met exactly one American who I would not be able to pick up as a foreigner over a phone.

The funniest part was when he switched to English and of course had a native American accent, my brain did a somersault trying to figure out which planet he came from.

 

[Wwanderer]

What I love is when native Japanese speakers insist that katakana captures the true pronunciation of the loan word!

Yes, odd...but to be fair, for some words the katakana indicates the correct pronunciation more clearly than the romanji English (true of some other languages too) spelling!

-Ww

 

[Wwanderer]

For me, the nuance of hantai would be more or less “counter” and that of gyaku would be “reverse”. Hantai is about positions whereas gyaku is about directions. As far as what they are talking about is a static object, the meaning is the same. On the direction of a moving object, gyaku alone can imply a reverse flow whereas hantai need to modify an appropriate noun (such as “houkou”) to make it the same meaning. I think the distinction is clear among the locals.

Nuance and connotation are one reason many people prefer slang and informal speech to "speaking properly" or professional jargon, not just in Japanese but in many, perhaps all, languages. For those with whom you share common slang etc, you can communicate subtle subtext and implications much better than with formally correct language usage.

-Ww

 

[chaztagster]

Nuance and connotation are one reason many people prefer slang and informal speech to "speaking properly" or professional jargon, not just in Japanese but in many, perhaps all, languages. For those with whom you share common slang etc, you can communicate subtle subtext and implications much better than with formally correct language usage.

I find that when people are speaking, they often make malapropisms that render their sentences truly meaningless. Sometimes they even use words that mean completely the opposite of what they intend to say. Nonetheless, they manage to convey the intended meaning because of the tone, body language, and shared assumptions. It's really impressive ... and really irritating. Literally! (LOL)

 

[Simonka]

I like to listen to shop clerks shouting out "irasshaimase" at customers who just walked in.

When it's a department store like Shibuya 109, the young girls have a vivid, vibrant voice that promises youthfulness and future dreams.
"Irasshaimase, doozo Goran kudasaimase"

When I was a new expat I never understood why clerks would tell me to have a look around since that's what I was figuratively and literally doing.

If it's a food store or a wholesale store, the women are older. May be they are divorcees, or they are working a few arubaitos at the same time. Their voices are deeper, you can tell they had some life experience; good and bad. And they rarely say, "doozo goran kudasaimase"

 

[TheScientist]

I like to listen to shop clerks shouting out "irasshaimase" at customers who just walked in.

There used to be this one clerk about 20 years ago who really put power into it, sometimes it was like one of those characters in Street Fighter or whatever, like a build up to a super power move. Your ears would be ringing for ten minutes afterwards. When this guy irashaimase'd, you KNEW you were welcomed to the store.

Sadly these days, most retail workers just do this robotic "se~~~" that sounds more like the bleating of a old sheep.

 

[Simonka]

There used to be this one clerk about 20 years ago who really put power into it, sometimes it was like one of those characters in Street Fighter or whatever, like a build up to a super power move. Your ears would be ringing for ten minutes afterwards. When this guy irashaimase'd, you KNEW you were welcomed to the store.

Sadly these days, most retail workers just do this robotic "se~~~" that sounds more like the bleating of a old sheep.

Oh.. I have a made up word for it: Hitsujirasshaimase

Today I met an ear ringing irasshaimaseusse. She was truly phenomenal. Somehow, she kept placing the items on the stall, in a trance like state, as if it was a holy duty for her and never made eye contact as she kept yelling irasshaimase on top of her lungs. I still felt welcome.