Completely Useless or Confusing Things in Tokyo

[User#8628]

They should get rid of katakana and replace it with hiragana since you pronounce it the same way anyway.

Katakana English is a nightmare to me. With having a little accent when speaking English myself + Japanese people choosing different katakana than most western people would spell it out as, sometimes i think i’m saying an English word the katakana way but nobody understand.
I think they sound close enough to understand anyway, but with speaking Japanese there is usually no such thing as “close enough”, people will immediately act like they don’t understand.

 

[ShowaJidai]

with speaking Japanese there is usually no such thing as “close enough"

The problem with "close enough" in Japanese is that it is often close enough to too many other possible words/ideas.

 

[impish]

They should get rid of katakana and replace it with hiragana since you pronounce it the same way anyway.

Katakana English is a nightmare to me. With having a little accent when speaking English myself + Japanese people choosing different katakana than most western people would spell it out as, sometimes i think i’m saying an English word the katakana way but nobody understand.
I think they sound close enough to understand anyway, but with speaking Japanese there is usually no such thing as “close enough”, people will immediately act like they don’t understand.

An interesting Quora post on the origins of Katakana, it's not what you would expect.

https://www.quora.com/Why-and-how-was-katakana-invented

 

[User#8628]

The problem with "close enough" in Japanese is that it is often close enough to too many other possible words/ideas.

Fair enough, but usually not with Japanized English words.

Why do people not understand me if i say イロンマン instead of イオンマン？

 

[MikeH]

Why do people not understand me if i say イロンマン instead of イオンマン？

Even I have problems understanding that. Are you trying to say アイロンマン?

My favourite word is still カクテル. I never get that right.

 

[Sterling]

Sometimes katakana is useful for learning how to pronounce non-English foreign names/words I'd have no clue about otherwise. Luckily for me I learned all the kanas in junior high school so I never had a problem remembering them.

And hey, I also wanted to add my support for train station jingles. Especially the ones that are specific to the area, like Astroboy for Takadanobaba and the Ebisu beer song at, well, Ebisu. And whenever I hear a jingle that's the same as the first place I ever lived in Japan, I get pangs of nostalgia.

But my vote for useless things? The guys who stand next to construction sites & guide you past, even though there are signs with arrows and the way is clear anyway. Japan has a lot of jobs that serve no other purpose than to keep someone employed, but often there's a lack of creativity in deciding what those useless employees get to do.

 

[MikeH]

The guys who stand next to construction sites & guide you past, even though there are signs with arrows and the way is clear anyway.

Like one of my Japanese business partners told me a long time ago: foreigners often mistake Japan as a capitalistic country when we are in fact a communism run by corporations.

 

[RIDER 00]

Like one of my Japanese business partners told me a long time ago: foreigners often mistake Japan as a capitalistic country when we are in fact a communism run by corporations.

That's a little extreme isn't it? The LDP isn't the CCP, but I will admit that it's damn close.
I'd say it's more liberal socialism.

 

[Sudsy]

I'd say it's more liberal socialism.

Pretty sure it's another form of socialism. The national kind.

 

[chaztagster]

Does anyone remember the re-entry permit for resident foreigners? That was a nice bit of useless bureaucracy.

 

[impish]

Does anyone remember the re-entry permit for resident foreigners? That was a nice bit of useless bureaucracy.

So glad they did away with that.

 

[MikeH]

Does anyone remember the re-entry permit for resident foreigners? That was a nice bit of useless bureaucracy.

Yeah, when I got my PR I was like "great, never have to go to immigration to line up for the whole day again" which they replied "welcome back in three years".

 

[MikeH]

So glad they did away with that.

Not totally if I remember correctly. If you stay out longer than a year you still need it.

 

[Wwanderer]

I believe it is used so Japanese people wouldn't be able to learn how to pronounce foreign words properly. If they did then they would go abroad and get detrimental influences.

I have long wondered if katakana’s purpose or appeal was to vividly separate “foreign words” from “true Japanese words” and thus help maintain the language’s “purity”.

In most countries there are those concerned with “protecting “ their language from being “contaminated” by other tongues and outside influences. Many French people are particularly obsessed/paranoid about this “threat” for some reason.

-Ww

 

[Wwanderer]

Though the only people complaining about katakana are usually those foreigners who then use romaji to learn Japanese.

Can anyone recommend a good “teach yourself Japanese” resource (book or software or whatever) that utilizes only romanji?

-Ww

 

[Ken1988]

An interesting Quora post on the origins of Katakana, it's not what you would expect.

https://www.quora.com/Why-and-how-was-katakana-invented

Not sure about this hypothesis. All I know is that hiragana have been used for handwriting by both men and women because you can write hiragana in cursive style (so-sho). Katakana were not for handwriting because they couldn’t be written in cursive style. Originally katakana were used to show how to read Chinese characters (with other scripts to covert the difference in syntax) and their use was limited. Katakana got an advantage after modern typography was introduced in Japan because it was easier to make the movable type for katakana. (This was true for old computer printers in the 60s/70s which only had katakana fonts). Typographers also preferred drafts written in katakana to hiragana in cursive style which could easily be illigible. By the late 19th century, katakana established its position as “print” scripts, and were extensively used for telegrams and other important documents which should not be written in cursive style. This distinction between katakana (print scrips) and hiragana (handwriting scripts) came to an end in the 1940s as more Japanese text were written horizontally. The Japanese cursive can flow only vertically. Over the past 60 years, more people started “print” in hiragana when handwriting, and the position of katakana returned back to that of original - to show how to read foreign words.

 

[Hofmeyer]

This might not have been the intention, but having unique jingles for each station on the Yamanote line is very helpful to people with impaired vision and who also might not understand Japanese or English. Minority though they may be.

 

[kingaddictx]

Does anyone remember the re-entry permit for resident foreigners? That was a nice bit of useless bureaucracy.

yea im a little confusef on that. was hoping to make a short trip to thailand in the fall, but then started reading about needing permits even with a valid visa. whsts the deal with that?

 

[User#8628]

I have long wondered if katakana’s purpose or appeal was to vividly separate “foreign words” from “true Japanese words” and thus help maintain the language’s “purity”.

Except that there are also Japanese worlds that have katakana writing

 

[Wwanderer]

Except that there are also Japanese worlds that have katakana writing

Which I find very confusing!

Maybe it is one of those micro-aggressions TJB complains about, trying to drive us gaijin crazy!

-Ww

 

[BankerguyCanada]

THE LACK OF TRASH CANS.

this absolutely blew me away the first time i was in tokyo... i couldnt believe the lack of public trash cans or recycling bins

 

[warubuta]

Sometimes katakana is useful for learning how to pronounce non-English foreign names/words I'd have no clue about otherwise. Luckily for me I learned all the kanas in junior high school so I never had a problem remembering them.

And hey, I also wanted to add my support for train station jingles. Especially the ones that are specific to the area, like Astroboy for Takadanobaba and the Ebisu beer song at, well, Ebisu. And whenever I hear a jingle that's the same as the first place I ever lived in Japan, I get pangs of nostalgia.

But my vote for useless things? The guys who stand next to construction sites & guide you past, even though there are signs with arrows and the way is clear anyway. Japan has a lot of jobs that serve no other purpose than to keep someone employed, but often there's a lack of creativity in deciding what those useless employees get to do.

Underemployment, when the alternative is unemployment, is not completely useless. He keeps people out of pachinko parlors.

 

[warubuta]

this absolutely blew me away the first time i was in tokyo... i couldnt believe the lack of public trash cans or recycling bins

No trash cans and very little trash around. People are expected to take their trash home, seperate it into catagories which include paper, cardboard, PET, plastic bottle caps, other plastic, aluminum, steel, batteries, fabric, food waste, cooking oil, bottles, large electric appliances, large items in general, milk cartons, cardboard boxes and probably another 20 or so kinds of trash that I cant think of right now. They all have to be disposed of on a certain day of the week and at a certain place, and they need to be clean. Yes, that's right, you need to wash your garbage before you throw it away.

 

[impish]

But my vote for useless things? The guys who stand next to construction sites & guide you past, even though there are signs with arrows and the way is clear anyway. Japan has a lot of jobs that serve no other purpose than to keep someone employed, but often there's a lack of creativity in deciding what those useless employees get to do.

Like the guys in their 60s who are situated at the entrances and exits of parking lots to manage incoming and outgoing traffic. Drives me crazy when I go grocery shopping. I do not need someone to mange me leaving the parking lot.

 

[MikeH]

Drives me crazy when I go grocery shopping.

I always open my window and thank them or at least give them a wave and a nod.

At least that job keeps them connected to the society so they don't gang up at late at night and go around the neighbourhood stealing hubcaps.