What Is Love?

[Jbagz]

What is love?

Haddaway posed this very important question in his 1993 Eurodance hit, and as far as this American can tell, all we got out of it was an incredibly funny Saturday Night Live skit.

I really want to know, what is love?

On the clinical level, I suspect that it is a hormonal response tied to human social interactions. Okay, that's my working definition, but I want more.

I'd really like to hear the TAG audience attempt to describe this fantastic and tragic human emotion.

I'm not sure I've ever experienced it. I have children and I do love them, I'd die to protect them in a flash.

However, I'm not sure that is really love. No matter how incredible and awesome I think my children are, I'm bound by biological programming to feel that way about them.

To focus this question on an aspect that is more relevant to the TAG forum, let's set a few parameters.

What is romantic love?

What is an example of you giving it?

What is an example of you receiving it?

My response:

What is romantic love?

I'm not sure, but I suspect that it involves performing an act that might be contrary to one's safety or self-interest.

What is an example of you giving it?

I drove 500 miles to Georgia one time to pick up an ex-girlfriend who was in a bit of trouble. The thrill was gone between us, but I still cared for her enough to do that. It might be the purest example of love or altruism that I have.

What is an example of you receiving it?

Another one of my Ex GFs stopped by my place with a six pack of beer and a box of chicken wings on my birthday.

That simple act surpasses anything I've ever experienced in the sphere of someone doing something just for me. Sure, she might have had ulterior motives, but I didn't sense them. I really believe that she just wanted to do something for me, because she loved me.

That's all I have on this subject, and I really want to know more.

What is love?

 

[Sinapse]

Love is the subjective feeling of the instinct to pass genes into the next generation with the highest chance of success.. With generally good but occasionally faulty or counterproductive efficacy

 

[Jbagz]

Love is the subjective feeling of the instinct to pass genes into the next generation with the highest chance of success.. With generally good but occasionally faulty or counterproductive efficacy

Not bad as far as your definition of romantic love, but you passed on answering the other two questions.

You should at least attempt to address them.

 

[zer0ed]

I see love (as a general term) as something that you give meaning to as opposed to having a concrete definition that everyone agrees upon.

What is romantic love?
It's an overwhelming fondness of another person so much so that you want to procreate with them. But I think that romantic relationships extend beyond only romantic love.

What is an example of you giving it?
Giving an ex relationship advice about a new guy that she started going out with and being truly happy for her despite my initial gut feeling of sadness.

What is an example of you receiving it?
The same ex having stayed with me for years despite me being emotionally absent and a shitty person for most of the time.

 

[Wwanderer]

What is love?

I'd really like to hear the TAG audience attempt to describe this fantastic and tragic human emotion.

Love is the subjective feeling of the instinct to pass genes into the next generation with the highest chance of success.. With generally good but occasionally faulty or counterproductive efficacy

What @Sinapse says is probably true, or at least a part of the truth of what produces/motivates love, but it is not an answer to the OP's question. It is not a description of "this fantastic and tragic human emotion". In other words, someone who has never experienced love personally would not learn much of anything about what it is like to feel love from this "definition".

Similarly I could say something along the lines of, "Love is a subjective human feeling that typically gives rise to the following behaviors: <a long list of human behaviors associated with being in love>", but that sort of definition would have the same sort of problem.

@Sinapse 's clever definition is a cause of love; my hypothetical one would tell you some of its consequences. Neither says what it is, what the experience is like.

-Ww

 

[Wwanderer]

The question raised in the OP is too hard for me, but I can suggest a place to start finding the answer. Try reading the books on this list:

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/culture/books/10604842/Best-romantic-novels-of-all-time.html

-Ww

 

[owlet]

The question raised in the OP is too hard for me, but I can suggest a place to start finding the answer. Try reading the books on this list:

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/culture/books/10604842/Best-romantic-novels-of-all-time.html

-Ww

..come on ww.. There are many of us who would like to hear your take on this

 

[Jbagz]

I see love (as a general term) as something that you give meaning to as opposed to having a concrete definition that everyone agrees upon.

What is romantic love?
It's an overwhelming fondness of another person so much so that you want to procreate with them. But I think that romantic relationships extend beyond only romantic love.

I like what you are getting at here. I do think that in the early days of an infatuation people driven primarily by biological programming.

It is an intense rush of hormones and pheromones and in my opinion, that really isn't love. We call it that, but I'm not so sure it is anything other than the trigger signals of human procreation.

Your distinction of romantic relationships might be the place that love can be found. But I have a hard time pinning it down and isolating it from all the other things that occur between two people.

I suspect that love might not exist, I fear it is a squishy word that we use to describe a great number of separate things that occur between people.

Is it a category of emotions, rather than an emotion? Or is love a behavior rather than a set of emotional cues?

 

[just4fun]

memories of pain and suffering..........

 

[Wwanderer]

..come on ww.. There are many of us who would like to hear your take on this

If anything occurs to me that seems worth posting here, I will.

So far, these two things seem like good insights to me:

I see love (as a general term) as something that you give meaning to as opposed to having a concrete definition that everyone agrees upon.

But I have a hard time pinning it down and isolating it from all the other things that occur between two people.

Is it a category of emotions, rather than an emotion?

I suspect that "love" has so many different meanings that trying to define it is not a useful undertaking, even if you restrict it to romantic love.

For sure it can be an extremely powerful emotion.


https://m.youtube.com/watch?autoplay=1&v=KCkgYhtz64U&vidve=5727

-Ww

 

[Jbagz]

The question raised in the OP is too hard for me, but I can suggest a place to start finding the answer. Try reading the books on this list:

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/culture/books/10604842/Best-romantic-novels-of-all-time.html

-Ww

Ugh! I'm afraid that list of books would only cloud the issue for me to an even greater degree.

I'm not entirely unfamiliar with the books on that list anyway.

I am at a place in my life where I'm trying to understand humanity from a psychological perspective.

I like what I read here: https://www.verywell.com/theories-of-love-2795341

 

[Wwanderer]

I am at a place in my life where I'm trying to understand humanity from a psychological perspective.

I suggest starting...and finishing...with something a lot easier!

If you are happy sticking to semantic games, you can always adopt some satisfyingly crisp and specific definition of love and say that those things which don't fit your definition aren't "really" love, but if you want to talk about the word and concept as people actually use it to describe their feelings and those of other people, it seems to me a hopeless quest to come up with anything very clear and specific. The word is used to mean many many different things in messy reality.

-Ww

 

[Jbagz]

I suggest starting...and finishing...with something a lot easier!

If you are happy sticking to semantic games, you can always adopt some satisfyingly crisp and specific definition of love and say that those things which don't fit your definition aren't "really" love, but if you want to talk about the word and concept as people actually use it to describe their feelings and those of other people, it seems to me a hopeless quest to come up with anything very clear and specific. The word is used to mean many many different things in messy reality.

-Ww

I got a pretty good chuckle from this. When I reflect upon my life it seems it has largely been a hopeless quest with no real goal.

I must enjoy tilting at windmills because I do it so much.

If I had the chance to go back and plot a new career path, I think I would enjoy psychology. To chart out human behavior in an attempt to undstand it is fascinating to me.

 

[owlet]

to me, love is simply the choice to be with someone, support someone and put their need's ahead of your own

of course.. a relationship cant be as one sided as that; they need to love you too

 

[Ches]

@Jbagz
Sorry this out of topic, do you happen to be @owlet 's buddy? What's up with the owl photos ?

 

[Jbagz]

I just like owls, they spend a lot of time watching activity unfold before they swoop down to catch their dinner.

The one in my avatar is a captive female European eagle owl, aren't her orange eyes beautiful?

I'm not sure about Owlet's photo, the rounded head makes me think it is some type of burrowing owl or a screech owl.

 

[Ches]

I'm not sure about Owlet's photo, the rounded head makes me think it is some type of burrowing owl or a screech owl.

Apparently it is a devolved mighty hawk
Or so I thought

But I like it better, cuter and more tamed

 

[roots reggae]

There was a discussion on this topic, mostly between Wwanderer and myself, in another thread, so I'll just copy and paste my thoughts from that thread to this one.

"I agree with the different kinds of love statement. That's why I singled out romantic love as being mutual. To me, if it's not mutual, it's not romantic love. Romantic love is shared and must be nourished by both parties.

I realize my view is not the commonly held notion of love. My view is closer to the one expressed here":

It is important to note however, that to qualify as genuine love, the sharing need be balanced between self and other. One shares the others thoughts and feelings as much as one's own, no more and no less.

The sharing of consciousness with the lover, unlike attachment, varies from moment to moment. Closeness and distance alternate, reaffirming not only the union, but also the individual autonomy of each member of the pair. The idea of the love bond as involving continuous attachment, on the one hand, but also varying amounts of closeness and separation solves a critical problem in the meaning of love. The bestseller Women Who Love Too Much (1985) describes continuing relationships with husbands who are abusive of wife or children, or both.

I don't think this discussion is off topic. We are examining the nature and differences of love and addiction. In order to reach a common understanding leading to fruitful discussion, the terms should certainly be defined and discussed.

"To answer your question, it's difficult to assign one term that would apply to all, or even most circumstances. One could call it intense emotional feelings, among others we have already touched upon, i.e. obsession and addiction. On a positive note, it could be devotion.

I've researched my point of view a bit further-that's the beauty of discussing topics like this on TAG. We hear other points of view and examine our own previously held beliefs and adjust those beliefs.

Anyway, an excerpt from a Psychology Today article that supports my perspective:"

Many characteristics of a potential partner, as well as situational factors, can romantically attach us to another person even though the relationship may be unhealthy. Some qualities that are initially thought to represent the kind of emotional bond we call “love,” eventually lead to the deterioration of the relationship. First of all, what is love, anyway? For the sake of this post, let’s just consider the healthy version of love as involving two individuals who maintain their separate identities, yet intimately join together based on mutual interests, excitement, enjoyment, the sharing of novel or stimulating experiences, and a shared capacity to learn from the negative emotions they experience.

Naturally, some of the relationship qualities that are found in a healthy partnership may also be present in an unhealthy one. Stimulating and exciting features of a relationship can motivate you to ignore the warning signs that it won’t meet your needs. Yet humans have an inclination to amplify what feels good and disregard disappointment, which may lead someone to believe it is love when it’s only confusion.

https://www.psychologytoday.com/blo...feelings/201508/is-it-love-or-is-it-confusion

And another excerpt from another Psychology Today article: (read the whole article-it's not long)

Impossible love is desire for someone that has little likelihood of fulfillment. Typically, the object of impossible love is thought of as someone who can appease your desires, but for various reasons is beyond your reach. Since humans are motivated to savor and maximize positive emotions and minimize negative ones, experiencing impossible love is stressful.

https://www.psychologytoday.com/blog/intense-emotions-and-strong-feelings/201404/impossible-love

The women profess that they can't leave these men because they love them too much. Since the word love is used so broadly in English, this usage is perfectly proper. Yet these kinds of relationships fail the test in terms of the way love is being defined here, because they lack balance between self and other. The wife identifies with the husband much, much more that he identifies with her. The wives are engulfed with their husbands. In these cases, the word love serves as denial of pathological dependency and/or passivity.

http://www.newenglishreview.org/Tho...Love:_Attraction,_Attachment,_and_Attunement/

1 Corinthians 13:4-8 New International Version (NIV)

4 Love is patient, love is kind. It does not envy, it does not boast, it is not proud.
5 It does not dishonor others, it is not self-seeking, it is not easily angered, it keeps no record of wrongs.
6 Love does not delight in evil but rejoices with the truth.
7 It always protects, always trusts, always hopes, always perseveres.
8 Love never fails
13 And now these three remain: faith, hope and love. But the greatest of these is love.

"Now, I am not saying this is the definitive meaning of love. I am merely using it as an example of what quite a few people, according to this particular religion, say what love is, and more to the point I made at my first post, what love is not-even when a great amount of the population still considers to be "love.""

Note: My words from the previous thread are in quotes. Those in italics are from other sources which are followed by links to their original source.

 

[rick]

Who knows? It all ends in tears anyway.

 

[roots reggae]

Who knows? It all ends in tears anyway.

Not all the time, my friend.

Yet, most of the time, I would agree whole-heartedly with you.

I am lucky enough to have transcended the pain and found nirvana.

 

[Jbagz]

There was a discussion on this topic, mostly between Wwanderer and myself, in another thread, so I'll just copy and paste my thoughts from that thread to this one.

"I agree with the different kinds of love statement. That's why I singled out romantic love as being mutual. To me, if it's not mutual, it's not romantic love. Romantic love is shared and must be nourished by both parties.

I realize my view is not the commonly held notion of love. My view is closer to the one expressed here":

It is important to note however, that to qualify as genuine love, the sharing need be balanced between self and other. One shares the others thoughts and feelings as much as one's own, no more and no less.

The sharing of consciousness with the lover, unlike attachment, varies from moment to moment. Closeness and distance alternate, reaffirming not only the union, but also the individual autonomy of each member of the pair. The idea of the love bond as involving continuous attachment, on the one hand, but also varying amounts of closeness and separation solves a critical problem in the meaning of love. The bestseller Women Who Love Too Much (1985) describes continuing relationships with husbands who are abusive of wife or children, or both.

I don't think this discussion is off topic. We are examining the nature and differences of love and addiction. In order to reach a common understanding leading to fruitful discussion, the terms should certainly be defined and discussed.

"To answer your question, it's difficult to assign one term that would apply to all, or even most circumstances. One could call it intense emotional feelings, among others we have already touched upon, i.e. obsession and addiction. On a positive note, it could be devotion.

I've researched my point of view a bit further-that's the beauty of discussing topics like this on TAG. We hear other points of view and examine our own previously held beliefs and adjust those beliefs.

Anyway, an excerpt from a Psychology Today article that supports my perspective:"

Many characteristics of a potential partner, as well as situational factors, can romantically attach us to another person even though the relationship may be unhealthy. Some qualities that are initially thought to represent the kind of emotional bond we call “love,” eventually lead to the deterioration of the relationship. First of all, what is love, anyway? For the sake of this post, let’s just consider the healthy version of love as involving two individuals who maintain their separate identities, yet intimately join together based on mutual interests, excitement, enjoyment, the sharing of novel or stimulating experiences, and a shared capacity to learn from the negative emotions they experience.

Naturally, some of the relationship qualities that are found in a healthy partnership may also be present in an unhealthy one. Stimulating and exciting features of a relationship can motivate you to ignore the warning signs that it won’t meet your needs. Yet humans have an inclination to amplify what feels good and disregard disappointment, which may lead someone to believe it is love when it’s only confusion.

https://www.psychologytoday.com/blo...feelings/201508/is-it-love-or-is-it-confusion

And another excerpt from another Psychology Today article: (read the whole article-it's not long)

Impossible love is desire for someone that has little likelihood of fulfillment. Typically, the object of impossible love is thought of as someone who can appease your desires, but for various reasons is beyond your reach. Since humans are motivated to savor and maximize positive emotions and minimize negative ones, experiencing impossible love is stressful.

https://www.psychologytoday.com/blog/intense-emotions-and-strong-feelings/201404/impossible-love

The women profess that they can't leave these men because they love them too much. Since the word love is used so broadly in English, this usage is perfectly proper. Yet these kinds of relationships fail the test in terms of the way love is being defined here, because they lack balance between self and other. The wife identifies with the husband much, much more that he identifies with her. The wives are engulfed with their husbands. In these cases, the word love serves as denial of pathological dependency and/or passivity.

http://www.newenglishreview.org/Tho...Love:_Attraction,_Attachment,_and_Attunement/

1 Corinthians 13:4-8 New International Version (NIV)

4 Love is patient, love is kind. It does not envy, it does not boast, it is not proud.
5 It does not dishonor others, it is not self-seeking, it is not easily angered, it keeps no record of wrongs.
6 Love does not delight in evil but rejoices with the truth.
7 It always protects, always trusts, always hopes, always perseveres.
8 Love never fails
13 And now these three remain: faith, hope and love. But the greatest of these is love.

"Now, I am not saying this is the definitive meaning of love. I am merely using it as an example of what quite a few people, according to this particular religion, say what love is, and more to the point I made at my first post, what love is not-even when a great amount of the population still considers to be "love.""

Note: My words from the previous thread are in quotes. Those in italics are from other sources which are followed by links to their original source.

The way you have presented it here, with your own words and the sources you cite, love would appear to be a set of behaviors.

Even the Psycology Today article that called love an emotional bond, stipulated that for the bond to be healthy, there has to be reciprocal behavior between the people involved.

From my vantage point, humanity often wrongly thinks of love as a tangible thing. We often refer to finding it as if it is a rare commodity, like diamonds or gold.

I'm leaning toward thinking romantic love is a set of behaviors that occurs between two people. As with any set of behaviors, there can be positive or negative results. For the sake of creating a term, let's call this set of behaviors, the human mating process.

I would like to keep this separate from sexual reproduction. I mean mating in the form of a series of interactions between two people that often results in an emotional bond

The notion of an emotional bond being the result of intimate behaviors might very well be the best description of love for me.

Since I reject magic, spirits and deities, looking at love as being based in behavior is sensible.

 

[User#8628]

What is romantic love?
I guess just being pulled to someone no matter what. Even if being with them could come between your life goals, even if they hurt you. I think love means that it's emotionally painful to stay away from someone. On the more positive side, being with them is like a drug. You are instantly very happy. You also feel the urge to deepen your relationship with them. You wanna share secrets and special moments, spend time together, go to a next stage like living together, marriage or starting a family. You complete each other and miss each other if you cant be together.

Example of my love:
If i'm in love i try to spend every free hour together. For example i took a taxi at midnight to see my boyfriend while we were both poor so that was a sacrifice. We would watch movies together every night and never get bored of it. Also if i'm in love i always get them a very attentive birthday/christmas present and souvenirs based on their personal taste.

Example of someone else's love for me:
My ex boyfriend begged me not to go to Japan. I postponed my visit for him but finally the Tokyo drift was stronger.
Also i have had another guy do something pretty brave for me out of love, but thats a personal story.
Also someone really lied a lot to me to not make me sad, but that is more of a personal problem of him than love i think. But still he had a super strong drift not to disappoint me, which he ultimately did when things came out of course.

 

[Jbagz]

What is romantic love?
I guess just being pulled to someone no matter what. Even if being with them could come between your life goals, even if they hurt you. I think love means that it's emotionally painful to stay away from someone. On the more positive side, being with them is like a drug. You are instantly very happy. You also feel the urge to deepen your relationship with them. You wanna share secrets and special moments, spend time together, go to a next stage like living together, marriage or starting a family. You complete each other and miss each other if you cant be together.

.

Isn't that great? The rush of hormones and pheromones is very much like being under the influence of drugs.

However, I've come to believe that isn't really love but merely trigger signals to initiate sexual reproduction.

It might be the precursor of forming a bond, but it isn't what I'm currently calling love.

BTW fellow TAGers, I started this thread with much less of an idea of what I would call love than I have now.

Thanks for helping me talk it out!

 

[roots reggae]

The way you have presented it here, with your own words and the sources you cite, love would appear to be a set of behaviors.

Even the Psycology Today article that called love an emotional bond, stipulated that for the bond to be healthy, there has to be reciprocal behavior between the people involved.

From my vantage point, humanity often wrongly thinks of love as a tangible thing. We often refer to finding it as if it is a rare commodity, like diamonds or gold.

I'm leaning toward thinking romantic love is a set of behaviors that occurs between two people. As with any set of behaviors, there can be positive or negative results. For the sake of creating a term, let's call this set of behaviors, the human mating process.

I would like to keep this separate from sexual reproduction. I mean mating in the form of a series of interactions between two people that often results in an emotional bond

The notion of an emotional bond being the result of intimate behaviors might very well be the best description of love for me.

Since I reject magic, spirits and deities, looking at love as being based in behavior is sensible.

In regards to romantic love:

Yes, it is a set of behaviors. That's the action part.

It is also a set of shared feelings. That's the emotional aspect.

Emotions + Behaviors= Love

 

[majimekun]

To me at least, love is simply what you want it to be and the word has a different meaning depending on who uses it.
That's why I never say "I love you".
And if I'm being told "I love you", I would't know what it means exactly.