Racism In Japan?

[John Chavers]

I'm not one to assume but are you a white guy? Try growing up as a chink or gook in Australia and see what real racism is. It's not a matter of me experiencing more extreme things but a deeper understanding of things people do and why they do them when it comes to this issue.

As I said earlier, enjoy your semi-inclusion, and try not to get the Scott Kang treatment.

 

[Username1]

View attachment 293
As I said earlier, enjoy your semi-inclusion, and try not to get the Scott Kang treatment.

Lol

 

[John Chavers]

As flippant as I sound, you guys really should be careful.

 

[Username1]

Feeling the love from John Chavers

 

[TAG Manager]

As flippant as I sound, you guys really should be careful.

How is that link related to any of the conversation in this thread? I don't really see how it related, even with Username1's comments included in the thought.

 

[TAG Manager]

So far, I've never experienced any real racism or problems while in Japan. (so far)

One thing that perplexed me though: I've got regular Japanese credit cards from SMBC but yet I was turned down for a ENOS card (to get the member's discount on gas) and at one time, I wanted to get a Yodobashi Gold Point Card w/Credit Card function... got turned down for that too. wtf?

My first SMBC credit card application was denied. I applied a 2nd time after I got my Japanese driver's license and was approved almost immediately.

I do own property in Japan and of course have a regular full-time job with a large Japanese company.

As for living: My first apartment in Japan, I remember the agent asking the landlord for approval of my application but that went off without a hitch.

Umm... I get looked over for the basic stuff like campaigners handing out fliers and other stuff that I'd rather avoid anyway.

 

[TAG Manager]

Wait. Forgot one point.

What is it with foreigners interacting with other foreigners? Sometimes people treat you like a disease and won't even acknowledge you. Non-Japanese women from Europe or America are the worst... sometimes I just want to speak in English but they just stick up this wall and give the GTFO routine.

I feel more tension between other Americans & Europeans than I feel with any other groups (aside from those freaky touts in Roppongi)... why is that? Is it just me?
...maybe I'm butt ugly...or smell? I really don't know.

 

[Username1]

So far, I've never experienced any real racism or problems while in Japan. (so far)

One thing that perplexed me though: I've got regular Japanese credit cards from SMBC but yet I was turned down for a ENOS card (to get the member's discount on gas) and at one time, I wanted to get a Yodobashi Gold Point Card w/Credit Card function... got turned down for that too. wtf?

My first SMBC credit card application was denied. I applied a 2nd time after I got my Japanese driver's license and was approved almost immediately.

I do own property in Japan and of course have a regular full-time job with a large Japanese company.

As for living: My first apartment in Japan, I remember the agent asking the landlord for approval of my application but that went off without a hitch.

Umm... I get looked over for the basic stuff like campaigners handing out fliers and other stuff that I'd rather avoid anyway.

Interesting... I actually try to avoid those ENOS guys on purpose - I pretend to read my phone when I see them hovering near me while filling up my car.

The banks really have their own system and this is based on which bank location. I've registered different company's here and tried to apply for a bank account for one and was rejected. Ordinarily, one would think it's because the company president on paper is non Japanese hence the rejection which equals racism. I have however learned this was not the case and a matter of meeting their own internal guidelines which to this day I still don't understand!

 

[John Chavers]

I don't really see how it related, even with Username1's comments included in the thought.

There are subtleties to mizushobai that Japanese (and ersatz Japanese like @Username1) customers are expected to know, and things can get ugly pretty quick when you're leaving if you don't know them. Visibly foreign customers are either given some leeway or outright refused service at the onset.

Basically, Scott Kang would be alive today if he was Scotty Jones, white American.

 

[TAG Manager]

Interesting... I actually try to avoid those ENOS guys on purpose - I pretend to read my phone when I see them hovering near me while filling up my car.

Interesting... Never had that happen. Hovering...because they want to help...or hovering....like you're going to steal gas? ol

I use ENOS because it's the closest gas station to my place and they usually have the better price. (plus you get the coupon with each purchase for 1 or 2 yen off each liter, usually)

 

[Username1]

Interesting... Never had that happen. Hovering...because they want to help...or hovering....like you're going to steal gas? ol

I use ENOS because it's the closest gas station to my place and they usually have the better price. (plus you get the coupon with each purchase for 1 or 2 yen off each liter, usually)

They usually think I'm Japanese and come up to me while I'm filling up and proceed to explain how much better the card is for saving. I've done the calculation and it's really is no saving anyway!

 

[k1234k]

The secret- whenever you apply for a credit card, you MUST accept the confirmation phone call from the credit card company in Japanese.

Got my first Japanese visa credit card back in the 90s after just 6 months in country, a one year visa, and a 3 million yen salary.

But the secret is that I answered the phone when they called to confirm my name, birthday and address, and whether or not I actually applied.

I've had other gaijin friends fly off the handle and scream 'racism' when they were declined credit, but when I advised them to try again, and be sure to answer the phone to confirm the details, voila, all of them got cards! (3 gaijin and counting).

I also noticed the same confirmation phone call when applying for a lease, and every other credit card I have applied for.

 

[Username1]

The secret- whenever you apply for a credit card, you MUST accept the confirmation phone call from the credit card company in Japanese.

Got my first Japanese visa credit card back in the 90s after just 6 months in country, a one year visa, and a 3 million yen salary.

But the secret is that I answered the phone when they called to confirm my name, birthday and address, and whether or not I actually applied.

I've had other gaijin friends fly off the handle and scream 'racism' when they were declined credit, but when I advised them to try again, and be sure to answer the phone to confirm the details, voila, all of them got cards! (3 gaijin and counting).

I also noticed the same confirmation phone call when applying for a lease, and every other credit card I have applied for.

Great piece of advice there and yet another reason to reconsider before jumping to pull out the racism card...

 

[jerrytokyo79]

Hi, guys,

Thank you for this good topic and all good thoughts here.
As a Chinese lived in Japan for more than 7 years and 3 years in Germany, I think I also have something to input based on my personal experience.

First of all, I think no body can deny that Japanese society is rather conservative even for their own people. The social custom makes people hesitate to try anything new including dealing with us gaijin.

As the owner of this thread mentioned, Chinese or Korean are more easily treated as target of racism/discrimination.
Yes, this is certainly true. Many Chinese believe that this can only be changed by a war...(just give you an idea of how strong the tension) However, you will not experience anything like being shouted to go back, which is only possible during extreme right wing political events. This is much different between east and west: Japanese people may not like you, but they tend to keep this away from you. If you ask me whether I am suffering from racism, I would phrase it like we are treated differently. For instance, I can not choose the design of my cash card because I am gaijin;-(
I know that in western standard this will be a problem!

Regarding to my life in Germany, I think it is much fun. German have their imagination for Chinese that we eat and live in a strange way, which I think most people out side of China have a similar impression. Anyway, this doesn't stop the communication between us but making a good topic to joke each other. For everyday life, no treated differently thing for sure. But I was bullied by some Turkish teenagers for a few times. For monger action, I visited FKK several times and encountered no problem at all.

I would conclude that in Japan, you can not avoid to be treated differently but in a mild way. In western society, you got much better protected by the legal system. But it is possible to experience something really nasty.
Thank you for time and your tolerance on my English.

 

[TAG Manager]

Thank you for time and your tolerance on my English.

Your English is fine, thank you very much for your post of clarity regarding your experiences in Japan.

For instance, I can not choose the design of my cash card because I am gaijin;-(

Really? What bank or card company is this? That's just stupid.

 

[jerrytokyo79]

It is called 77bank locates in Sendai. This policy never changes.
I can imagine how psd's life is if you are living outside of Tokyo.
I am not saying Tokyo is perfect but it is surely better!

 

[Username1]

It is called 77bank locates in Sendai. This policy never changes.
I can imagine how psd's life is if you are living outside of Tokyo.
I am not saying Tokyo is perfect but it is surely better!

Those Ampanman and Pooh-san cards are meant to be for kids only

 

[jerrytokyo79]

Haha, thanks for your reminding
I am aware of that.

 

[TAG Manager]

Those Ampanman and Pooh-san cards are meant to be for kids only

LOL.

It is called 77bank locates in Sendai. This policy never changes.
I can imagine how psd's life is if you are living outside of Tokyo.
I am not saying Tokyo is perfect but it is surely better!

I think my banks have custom cards, will have to see what they offer... never even thought about that.

By the way, does anyone have a Super flyers card? I think I'm going to target this during the 2015 cycle if all goes well.

 

[GoldenDalton]

I'm half-white, half American Indian. In my opinion racism in Japan is much more severe than in the United States, save for that exhibited by minorities towards whites ( and ESPECIALLY successful, conservative minorities). I do not have much experience with other English speaking countries.
Some reasons:

1. Japan does not allow mass immigration. In the United States, we are brow-beaten into not only allowing mass immigration, but are actually forced into accepting voluntarily changing the ethnic make-up of the nation , which screws poor minorities even more than whites.

2. Politicians in Japan almost universally reflect the dominant ethnicity there, whereas the most powerful leader in our nation, as well as A huge chunk of his cabinet, the congress, and the Supreme Court consists of minorities.

3. Minorities can actually burn down a huge chunk of a city, murder whites (a Bosnian immigrant was beaten to death with hammers recently- and sure enough, the authorities insisted it was not a hate crime, lmao) because a clear-cut legal case doesn't go their way, and guess what- the police area they standing down and allowing them to do it. Now imagine that happening in Japan.

4. In the u.s., the nation's history is vilified in university level
Courses, and even in high schools today. In japan actual war crimes are denied or glossed over. Whereas white Americans will never be forgiven for slavery.

5. In the u.s., a minority can rob a gas station, muscle a small, elderly
Store owner, and assault a police officer and try to take his gun, and STILL a HUGE chunk of the nation supports him and condemns the policeman who killed him, THIS IN SPITE OF UNDENIABLE EVIDENCE/ a BLOOD TRAIL proving the guy charged the cop. Imagine that in Japan.

6. In the u.s., minorities can call for white genocide openly, while whites are fired for expressing their ethnicity's interests in the slightest. Imagine that in Japan.

Ultimately what it boils down to is that the u.s. Population is forced to accept millions of non-native blacks/whites/others . Many bitch about racism, but yet they stay, with many doing everything they can to become citizens. Compare that to Japan. It's not even close.

Hell, if I had a dollar for how many times white people have tried to shut me down for criticizing the more deviant forms of black culture and other forms of anti-Americanism, i'd be a wealthy man. i'd be even wealthier if I had one for every time a white person backed down to me just because I'm Indian, out of white guilt, of which I have zero, in spite of being half white.

The vast majority of racist acts I've experienced have been because of blacks. I'm fact, there are grants out there for me to continue my work JUST BECAUSE IM INDIAN. How many Ainu have scholarships and set-asides in Japan?

Some guy doing the "slant eyes" thing is not a big deal. Neither is some redneck not being able to tell the difference between Asian cultures, or assuming an Asian knows karate.


In Japan I've experienced a man actually grabbing my penis at the beach, wanting to know how big it was. Japanese people have actually avoided sitting by me on trains. Servers have made it clear that I'm not welcome in a couple of restaurants. And how many people have reported having trouble with renting, buying perp perry, getting a driver's license, etc. ? The "language issue" is a smokescreen. Even fluent gaijin have reported being rejected.

But most of all, it's the staring that I'm going to have to learn to live with. I'm a big, fairly tall guy just naturally. And it freaks people out. That IS racism, as Being physically large is a big part of being Kiowa. If a white person is out off by a black person's size, or an Asian guy is not considered attractive because of his height and/or facial features, MANY people in the u.s. Would say that's racist. Now in Japan........

What it boils down to is that Americans are willing to share their territory with non-Americans, allow them to become permanent Americans, while japanese desire to keep their nation homogenous. If a white American were to say that it'd be racism, so what's good for the goose.....

 

[GoldenDalton]

Thank you GoldenDalton for being an unapologetic truth-sayer. These issues are the real deal. Japan is Fantasy Island.

Hey thanks! Normally people csnt stand my views lol.

 

[Keiji]

For caucasians from North America or Europe, I think it's fair to say that they have probably never experienced any kind of racism in their lives until they came to Japan.

So in some ways, I think my white friends kind of overreact with shock and horror at their negative experiences in Japan.

I grew up as a minority in a predominantly white American community, and have most certainly encountered and been the victim of outright race hatred from ignorant white trailer trash. You learn to have a thick skin real quick.

So when I hear of acts of racism in Japan, I feel sympathetic, but a part of me is saying 'come on- that's NOTHING. It's not like groups of Japanese men are bullying you on the streets, screaming 'Honky Go Home!' at you as they drive by, destroying your property, or worse.

And another part of me is saying 'Welcome to my world, white man. Sucks, doesn't it? So how about we all try to learn some tolerance and just try to get along?'

White people complaining in this forum oftenly look ridiculous to me. Since the nature of this website is about P4P, its in the sex business where westerns make negative comments the most.

Most of the users here complain about the "Japanese only" sign at red zone shops. But for minorities living in the Western world it was much more degradating than that. How many times in my teenage years was I denied entry to a DANCE CLUB just because I was Japanese? The touts used to hold me outside saying stuff like: "Get the fuck off here and go back to China..." I was cut out to regunar venues, NOT ヘルス, ソプランド, or ピンクサロンs, just regular clubs.

All the supposely nice white people that whine here had come to Japan as adults some time after the beginning of the 2000s. But for minorities in the West, most of us faced White Racism while we were kids, teenagers....at young ages. It is much harder to take on White Racism when you are just a little boy than try to fend yourself off while already in adulthood.

If it were to be true that western countries had "embraced cultural diversity" as they "try" to shove it off here... then where were you all TAG registered users when I needed you the most? Because "supposely" everybody here (and in the West) is nice... so how come I never encountered them while I was there? Why nobody stood by my side when I was being targeted?

...And then you all say that the Japanese tend to ignore it, deny it or hide about it...

 

[GoldenDalton]

White people complaining in this forum oftenly look ridiculous to me. Since the nature of this website is about P4P, its in the sex business where westerns make negative comments the most.

Most of the users here complain about the "Japanese only" sign at red zone shops. But for minorities living in the Western world it was much more degradating than that. How many times in my teenage years was I denied entry to a DANCE CLUB just because I was Japanese? The touts used to hold me outside saying stuff like: "Get the fuck off here and go back to China..." I was cut out to regunar venues, NOT ヘルス, ソプランド, or ピンクサロンs, just regular clubs.

All the supposely nice white people that whine here had come to Japan as adults some time after the beginning of the 2000s. But for minorities in the West, most of us faced White Racism while we were kids, teenagers....at young ages. It is much harder to take on White Racism when you are just a little boy than try to fend yourself off while already in adulthood.

If it were to be true that western countries had "embraced cultural diversity" as they "try" to shove it off here... then where were you all TAG registered users when I needed you the most? Because "supposely" everybody here (and in the West) is nice... so how come I never encountered them while I was there? Why nobody stood by my side when I was being targeted?

...And then you all say that the Japanese tend to ignore it, deny it or hide about it...

Some discrimination is bound to happen, due to humanity's fallen nature, but the United States has had laws against public discrimination for many decades now.

I'm a minority myself, and I have very rarely encountered any kind of hate from whites or really anyone else ( of a specifically racial nature).

I don't know when you were in Japan, but there have been Japanese-Americsnd since the 19th century, including several very prominent politicians ( including a senator). I would not think the reverse of that would happen in Japan ( where a non- Asisn gaijin gets to be a politician).


I would need to know more regarding your experiences to see where you are coming from. I've been to the supposedly ultra racist places and not even experienced much there. In fact I've seen many Asians running successful businesses in southern states and largely integrated into the larger society.

You have lots of whites adopting babies from China, thousands of Asians becoming U.S. citizens through naturalization. Also interracial
Marriage is generally accepted ( like the president, I am also bi-racial).

I'm just not seeing much like that in Japan. Don't get me wrong- I understand why the japanese don't want " diversity," as out society is starting to really struggle with it.

But it seems like there are so many more opportunities in the U S. For immigrants than in other countries.


I mean, there are American politicians insisting that illegal immigrants in the U.S. Be granted drivers' licenses. I can't imagine that in Japan. I've heard that it's hard to get a drivers license there if you are an immigrant.

Don't misunderstand- I'm not saying you are wrong. I'm eager to hear more of what you have to say.

 

[meiji]

All the supposely nice white people that whine here had come to Japan as adults some time after the beginning of the 2000s. But for minorities in the West, most of us faced White Racism while we were kids, teenagers....at young ages. It is much harder to take on White Racism when you are just a little boy than try to fend yourself off while already in adulthood.

If it were to be true that western countries had "embraced cultural diversity" as they "try" to shove it off here... then where were you all TAG registered users when I needed you the most?

I'm not sure what the objection is here. That because TAG users don't immediately stick up for everyone when it comes to racism, that there's no racism in these Japanese hobby? Feel free to explain further.

I think the big problem that a lot of men find in Japan, right or wrong, is that they are shut out of the vast majority of options in Japan, especially if they speak no Japanese. You can name most other countries in the world and even if the girl speaks no English, there's still options for English speakers.

I've been with a LOT of women in both North America and Asia where girls spoke very little English or no English, and even if they primarily catered to other Asians, they were open to Westerners.

Is that unfair? Is it racism? I can't really say. But there's a sizable number of women out there in just about any other country that is more than willing to have sex with Westerners, regardless of race or language. This is very rarely true in Japan, for both agencies and women.

 

[Keiji]

I have quoted a reply that says "most Americans wouldn't have ever bother about racism if it weren't because they left their own country". My follow-up comment comes from after watching this forum for like 3 years and reading countless complains from white people to which I always thought to myself: 'That also happens in your own country". But most whites are never "awared of"...which if they were...they wouldnt complain about. I find several complains to be dishonest. I dislike the stereotype American who thinks that Americans are all nice people and anybody else outside US soil is any negative connotation...you name it: Communist, Terrorist, Fundamentalist, Arab, etc.