Does The Concept Of Not Texting/calling Back Resulting Reflect In Japanese Culture?

[Odin]

Long time lurker, first time poster. I'm curious about something.

Ever since I have moved here to Japan months ago I have been wanting to date women. Some encounters I have been successful in, others I have not. Many I have been led on, seemingly. For the encounters that I have been seemingly led on in, it has resulted in those women not texting back or me always contacting them.

For one particular situation, there is a girl I know in my Martial Arts class that I take, Muay Thai. She used to come frequently but hasn't as of late most likely because she is in the Japanese Navy. Understandable. One day, after training, she walked up to me and started a conversation with little English she knows. After that we exchanged FB info and started talking from there. I succeed in getting her into a deeper conversation and eventually asked her out on a date, didn't go as planned.

The date felt kind of rushed considering the fact that she was getting ready to go on a trip to America for holiday soon and she had to buy a gift for one of her friends there. But we still had a good time, so not so bad.

Ever since then, which was recent, she has stopped getting into contact with me. However, she has added me on Instagram and liked my postings of photography on there, also on FB.

So am I wasting my time? Or should I go for it?

 

[Odin]

Also, if it helps, I am a black male. I think it's sad that I have to include that but it seems that black/african american men here in this country have strange experiences.

 

[Chocoballs]

Also, if it helps, I am a black male. I think it's sad that I have to include that but it seems that black/african american men here in this country have strange experiences.

According to the author of the book "Black Passenger Yellow Cabs" being black is actually awesome to get girls.
"Black Passenger, Yellow Cabs: A Memoir Of Exile and Excess In Japan, provides a gritty, explicit rendering of a life ravaged by sexual addiction in a land little known for such wanton exploits."

(I saw a video of the author and the guy seems quite fun, charming and nice-looking too. I guess he would have picked up girls even if he wasn't black.)

 

[Odin]

According to the author of the book "Black Passenger Yellow Cabs" being black is actually awesome to get girls.
"Black Passenger, Yellow Cabs: A Memoir Of Exile and Excess In Japan, provides a gritty, explicit rendering of a life ravaged by sexual addiction in a land little known for such wanton exploits."

(I saw a video of the author and the guy seems quite fun, charming and nice-looking too. I guess he would have picked up girls even if he wasn't black.)

I may need to find a PDF of that and read it, seems interesting.

 

[Solong]

Long time lurker, first time poster. I'm curious about something.

Ever since I have moved here to Japan months ago I have been wanting to date women. Some encounters I have been successful in, others I have not. Many I have been led on, seemingly. For the encounters that I have been seemingly led on in, it has resulted in those women not texting back or me always contacting them.

For one particular situation, there is a girl I know in my Martial Arts class that I take, Muay Thai. She used to come frequently but hasn't as of late most likely because she is in the Japanese Navy. Understandable. One day, after training, she walked up to me and started a conversation with little English she knows. After that we exchanged FB info and started talking from there. I succeed in getting her into a deeper conversation and eventually asked her out on a date, didn't go as planned.

The date felt kind of rushed considering the fact that she was getting ready to go on a trip to America for holiday soon and she had to buy a gift for one of her friends there. But we still had a good time, so not so bad.

Ever since then, which was recent, she has stopped getting into contact with me. However, she has added me on Instagram and liked my postings of photography on there, also on FB.

So am I wasting my time? Or should I go for it?

1) I think your first mistake was Facebook.

Facebook usually works well for women who WANT attention (or attention whores), but often terribly for guys, in terms of dating. It's because the guys are often creating and attracting unnecessary attention to their relationship. Attention that specific woman OR guy may NOT want. And the man or woman might not know the ramifications at first of people/friends/family looking through their Facebook profile.

Time and time again, I see guys get pulled into exchanging with females there and losing the girl.

Facebook is better for when you WANT attention, not for when you or her don't.

2) Japanese Women Going Silent

This is not specific to race or because your Black, as Japanese women do it to White and other Asian guys.

It's usually more cowardice and fears/paranoia than anything, where they want to avoid any confrontation or became paranoid/fearful about the relationship or possible relationship, so seek to make a quiet exit.

 

[Odin]

1) I think your first mistake was Facebook.

Facebook usually works well for women who WANT attention (or attention whores), but often terribly for guys, in terms of dating. It's because the guys are often creating and attracting unnecessary attention to their relationship. Attention that specific woman OR guy may NOT want. And the man or woman might not know the ramifications at first of people/friends/family looking through their Facebook profile.

Time and time again, I see guys get pulled into exchanging with females there and losing the girl.

Facebook is better for when you WANT attention, not for when you or her don't.

2) Japanese Women Going Silent

This is not specific to race or because your Black, as Japanese women do it to White and other Asian guys.

It's usually more cowardice and fears/paranoia than anything, where they want to avoid any confrontation or became paranoid/fearful about the relationship or possible relationship, so seek to make a quiet exit.

Interesting, I figured that Facebook seems like a ego-boosting pit of likes and faux inspirational comments and when it comes to dating it would lead to nowhere. But I second guessed myself.

I never understood why Japanese women had fears about a possible relationship, especially with a gaijin. I've assumed that some people here in the country are closed minded about people from other countries and would rather not waste time mingling with foreigners, scared to do it, possibly. For shame.

By the way, I just finished reading some of your reply about Roppongi, my thoughts are similar to the club scene period here in Japan, even though I have not been to Roppongi. I assume you are familar with the "Honcho" in Yokosuka? Epitome of a snake pit.

 

[Solong]

I assume you are familar with the "Honcho" in Yokosuka? Epitome of a snake pit.

Yes, like the clubs Geodana (would play darts against the owner, years ago...) and Buffalo down dobuita st. Years past, have hung out in the area.

Though in defense of the owner of Geodana, that restaurant he opened up (with the same name) has/had great food.

If you can, would advise Yokohama's Motomachi area as a better hangout. I've found clubs there and Bay Hall to be more fun in the past or at least better than the Honch. Arguably better quality of girlfriends found. [emoji6]

 

[Odin]

Yes, like the clubs Geodana (would play darts against the owner, years ago...) and Buffalo down dobuita st. Years past, have hung out in the area.

Though in defense of the owner of Geodana, that restaurant he opened up (with the same name) has/had great food.

If you can, would advise Yokohama's Motomachi area as a better hangout. I've found clubs there and Bay Hall to be more fun in the past or at least better than the Honch. Arguably better quality of girlfriends found. [emoji6]

I just may try it out, I don't go clubbing often but sometimes it's fun.

 

[Chocoballs]

I may need to find a PDF of that and read it, seems interesting.

The ebook is only 400 yen. Just buy it

One half of the book is about his sexual adventures and the other half is about his views on Japanese society. The latter half is actually much more interesting. He brings up lots of statistics about sexuality in Japan, child abuse, female suppression, etc. It really makes you realize that Japanese society is totally messed up if you already didn't think so.

 

[calippo]

Interesting: I am a chef and I random add Japanese girls who post on Italian cooking groups on fb. I succeded in dating one from Yokosuka, and she works as a host there but told me only after our date. Fb works well for me!

 

[Solong]

Interesting: I am a chef and I random add Japanese girls who post on Italian cooking groups on fb. I succeded in dating one from Yokosuka, and she works as a host there but told me only after our date. Fb works well for me!

If you or her want or don't mind the attention... Not everybody does.

Plus as a chef, you have obvious business motives. Facebook is a form of advertising, and you can play off having loads of women on your page, because you are promoting your business or trying to get famous. Especially if you don't have a steady girlfriend or aren't married.

Where if you were an office secretary, your friends or boyfriend might question and ask, "Who the hell is X guy on your page?" or go digging up info about the guy by searching his page.

Another point is Tinder arguably has replaced Facebook, in terms of dating purposes. Allows for more anonymity and stealth.

 

[User#8628]

The ebook is only 400 yen. Just buy it

One half of the book is about his sexual adventures and the other half is about his views on Japanese society. The latter half is actually much more interesting. He brings up lots of statistics about sexuality in Japan, child abuse, female suppression, etc. It really makes you realize that Japanese society is totally messed up if you already didn't think so.

You mean the overly repeated steriotypes?
If it's so messed up what are you doing out here?

 

[Chocoballs]

You mean the overly repeated steriotypes?

Maybe the book is full of stereotypes but at least he gives statistics and did some research. Here are some quotes from the book.

"According to a 2002 survey by the Ministry of Health Labor and Welfare, one in fifteen Japanese suffer debilitating depression, much like I suffered from birth to my mid thirties. However, those figures were challenged by another renowned Japanese psychiatrist, Dr. Kazuo Sakai, who states that a 1:5 ratio more accurately portrays chronic depression among the Japanese."

"But the number one reason why the pill is still lagging behind after being approved since 1999, is the grand effort to maintain the vibrancy of the $400 million a year abortion industry."

"According to a Cabinet Office survey conducted from October to December of 2003 in five countries, more than half of Japanese and South Koreans are reluctant to procreate, citing exorbitantly high costs and “unsuitable” conditions contemptible to child raring in their respective countries."

"According to government studies conducted in 2006 and reported in The Yomiuri Shinbun in November 2008, among fathers with children aged 9-14 years old, 23.3% had no contact or interaction with their children on weekdays. Fifteen minutes of daily weekday contact was made by 14.7% of fathers, 21.9% had 30 minutes and 24.1% had about an hour."

If it's so messed up what are you doing out here?

Yes I am thinking of leaving Japan. I don't think I would want to have my children go to a Japanese school.

 

[User#8628]

Maybe the book is full of stereotypes but at least he gives statistics and did some research. Here are some quotes from the book.

"According to a 2002 survey by the Ministry of Health Labor and Welfare, one in fifteen Japanese suffer debilitating depression, much like I suffered from birth to my mid thirties. However, those figures were challenged by another renowned Japanese psychiatrist, Dr. Kazuo Sakai, who states that a 1:5 ratio more accurately portrays chronic depression among the Japanese."

"But the number one reason why the pill is still lagging behind after being approved since 1999, is the grand effort to maintain the vibrancy of the $400 million a year abortion industry."

"According to a Cabinet Office survey conducted from October to December of 2003 in five countries, more than half of Japanese and South Koreans are reluctant to procreate, citing exorbitantly high costs and “unsuitable” conditions contemptible to child raring in their respective countries."

"According to government studies conducted in 2006 and reported in The Yomiuri Shinbun in November 2008, among fathers with children aged 9-14 years old, 23.3% had no contact or interaction with their children on weekdays. Fifteen minutes of daily weekday contact was made by 14.7% of fathers, 21.9% had 30 minutes and 24.1% had about an hour."


Yes I am thinking of leaving Japan. I don't think I would want to have my children go to a Japanese school.

Ijime/bullying is international. I went to school in west Europe and from early primary school to the end of highschool i've been bullied and excluded non stop. Its been very traumatic and marked my childhood in a lovely, caring family. It gave me a (irrational) disliking of my country and the people there so i'm happy to live abroad. I think west Europe is generally a nice place to live for people but i don't want to go back there.

I've been worried too about raising hafus in Japan but i find that foreigners and hafus are generally popular with their japanese classmates. Bullying doesn't depend that much on your looks but more on your attitude. If a child is very shy and can't make friends easily and can't stand up for themselves they are likely to be picked on. There is always something weird to find that they can picking your child on but if your child is assertive or has friends standing up for them they wont become bullying victims.

Also Japanese education systhem is not ideal but the American one is also not that good and the European ones also have flaws. Education is generally flawed because it focuses on test scores.

For the "Japan is messed up" thing; just look at other countries. America is equally messed up. Europe is trying but there are dirty layers underneath their niceness. All countries have their flaws, Japan is not special in this. But actually, if companies cut the unnecessary overwork and started being more efficient and people invested in their romantic and social life and not just in their carreer i think it would have a positive influence on the number of depressed people.

 

[Chocoballs]

For the "Japan is messed up" thing; just look at other countries. America is equally messed up. Europe is trying but there are dirty layers underneath their niceness. All countries have their flaws, Japan is not special in this. But actually, if companies cut the unnecessary overwork and started being more efficient and people invested in their romantic and social life and not just in their carreer i think it would have a positive influence on the number of depressed people.

That is true there is no perfect country. America seems messed up too. I'm probably more critical as a foreigner here.

Long time lurker, first time poster. I'm curious about something.
Ever since then, which was recent, she has stopped getting into contact with me. However, she has added me on Instagram and liked my postings of photography on there, also on FB.

So am I wasting my time? Or should I go for it?

It seems to happen more in Japan than in other Asian countries. I heard other foreigners complaining about it. In the beginning I was puzzled by this behavior myself but now I just think that if someone doesn't reply then they are just not interested. I interpret it as their way of saying no.

I had the same problem of a woman sending me messages and I didn't like her. I am trying to be polite so I always reply but I can understand it is just easier to ignore.

 

[Odin]

I suppose it can be interpreted as being an easy way to avoid confrontation. Seems really cowardly, though. Saying no isn't difficult to someone.

 

[BlackJack1]

That is true there is no perfect country. America seems messed up too. I'm probably more critical as a foreigner here.


It seems to happen more in Japan than in other Asian countries. I heard other foreigners complaining about it. In the beginning I was puzzled by this behavior myself but now I just think that if someone doesn't reply then they are just not interested. I interpret it as their way of saying no.

I had the same problem of a woman sending me messages and I didn't like her. I am trying to be polite so I always reply but I can understand it is just easier to ignore.

I think your assumption is partially correct as I know Japanese ladies are workaholic,they don't have time to reply message especially the ones in english which requires them additional time to interpret it.

 

[Solong]

I think your assumption is partially correct as I know Japanese ladies are workaholic,they don't have time to reply message especially the ones in english which requires them additional time to interpret it.

Is There Really An Excuse For Not Replying?

I don't think work is an excuse. People are usually NOT working 24 hours a day, so at some point they have time to reply to messages. Also there isn't an expectation or it's acceptable not to answer right away with SMS, e-mail, or LINE. So if a person replies 8 hours later, it can be a non-issue for many, just as long as there was a reply.

I think it's better to make it clear that you don't want to continue the conversation versus not replying at all. Also the issue is often why act so nice, exchange contact info, or be so FAKE in the first place if you actually don't like the person?

For instance, if I didn't like a woman, I would outright refuse or at least offer a reason to NOT exchange contact info in the first place. To exchange contact info with people you don't like, speaks to being mentally confused and other issues.


How To Handle The Language Problem

I do think language can be an issue, which is why sending dual Japanese and English messages can be helpful. Whenever I'm talking to Japanese women of low English ability, I tend to send dual language messages and make it clear they can reply in either language.

Note- some Japanese are afraid to send kanji based messages to foreigners, not realizing that Google Translate and other programs can translate it into English.

The dual language messages are greatly appreciated by some Japanese women trying to learn or are studying English. However, some other Japanese women have a preference. Some like to interact with foreigners in only English or some like messages in only Japanese. I start with dual language messages, for those not fluent in English, and it often eventually becomes a certain pattern or a preference shows itself after a while.

Also Google Translate is your friend. BUT, you have to know how to use it and it's best if you have it translate simple sentences or break down what you want to say into simple sentences. The grammar can get all jacked up or an odd word given in translation, but the more Japanese you do know, the easier it is to fix the translation or grammar.

 

[Odin]

Is There Really An Excuse For Not Replying?

I don't think work is an excuse. People are usually NOT working 24 hours a day, so at some point they have time to reply to messages. Also there isn't an expectation or it's acceptable not to answer right away with SMS, e-mail, or LINE. So if a person replies 8 hours later, it can be a non-issue for many, just as long as there was a reply.

I think it's better to make it clear that you don't want to continue the conversation versus not replying at all. Also the issue is often why act so nice, exchange contact info, or be so FAKE in the first place if you actually don't like the person?

For instance, if I didn't like a woman, I would outright refuse or at least offer a reason to NOT exchange contact info in the first place. To exchange contact info with people you don't like, speaks to being mentally confused and other issues.


How To Handle The Language Problem

I do think language can be an issue, which is why sending dual Japanese and English messages can be helpful. Whenever I'm talking to Japanese women of low English ability, I tend to send dual language messages and make it clear they can reply in either language.

Note- some Japanese are afraid to send kanji based messages to foreigners, not realizing that Google Translate and other programs can translate it into English.

The dual language messages are greatly appreciated by some Japanese women trying to learn or are studying English. However, some other Japanese women have a preference. Some like to interact with foreigners in only English or some like messages in only Japanese. I start with dual language messages, for those not fluent in English, and it often eventually becomes a certain pattern or a preference shows itself after a while.

Also Google Translate is your friend. BUT, you have to know how to use it and it's best if you have it translate simple sentences or break down what you want to say into simple sentences. The grammar can get all jacked up or an odd word given in translation, but the more Japanese you do know, the easier it is to fix the translation or grammar.

Nail on the head.

 

[Odin]

I feel like I shouldn't get racial about this topic, but I believe it is so prominent in Japanese culture. At least in the case of dating and relationships.

Ever since I have arrived here and started to explore around the country I've noticed something about couples here in Japan. It seems to me that there is some sort of hierarchy according to race, ranging from light to dark skin. Maybe it is the influences from European countries and others, I'm not sure. But I rarely see Japanese/Black(and it's subcategories) together. In the off chance that I do see a couple that falls in that category it's for the wrong reasons. Black males are usually portrayed as thugs/gangsters, dressing wildly(such as having pants below their waist), or anything else degrading. I imagine that Japanese have limited access to American television and only see the portrayals of people from America. Universally, this must happen because there are many misconstrued opinions of every country. This is how stereotypes come about, I guess.

 

[KJos]

Long time lurker, first time poster. I'm curious about something.

Ever since I have moved here to Japan months ago I have been wanting to date women. Some encounters I have been successful in, others I have not. Many I have been led on, seemingly. For the encounters that I have been seemingly led on in, it has resulted in those women not texting back or me always contacting them.

For one particular situation, there is a girl I know in my Martial Arts class that I take, Muay Thai. She used to come frequently but hasn't as of late most likely because she is in the Japanese Navy. Understandable. One day, after training, she walked up to me and started a conversation with little English she knows. After that we exchanged FB info and started talking from there. I succeed in getting her into a deeper conversation and eventually asked her out on a date, didn't go as planned.

The date felt kind of rushed considering the fact that she was getting ready to go on a trip to America for holiday soon and she had to buy a gift for one of her friends there. But we still had a good time, so not so bad.

Ever since then, which was recent, she has stopped getting into contact with me. However, she has added me on Instagram and liked my postings of photography on there, also on FB.

So am I wasting my time? Or should I go for it?

I think it's just their way of saying no or not interested without actually saying or writing it. I have had countless such experiences especially over chat. Everything is going well and eventually we come to the part about where I am from. When they hear South Asia, suddenly it's complete silence. At best, someone more courteous might string you along for a while and then make last minute excuses on how they cannot meet you. Given that it has happened so many times to me here, I have come to consider it as normal behavior for the average Japanese girl.

 

[Odin]

I think it's just their way of saying no or not interested without actually saying or writing it. I have had countless such experiences especially over chat. Everything is going well and eventually we come to the part about where I am from. When they hear South Asia, suddenly it's complete silence. At best, someone more courteous might string you along for a while and then make last minute excuses on how they cannot meet you. Given that it has happened so many times to me here, I have come to consider it as normal behavior for the average Japanese girl.

The same has happened to me. It's saddening and frustrating.

 

[Chocoballs]

The same has happened to me. It's saddening and frustrating.

I now see it as part of the multicultural experience. No reply is frustrating but once you know how it works you just have to adjust your expectations.

I think your assumption is partially correct as I know Japanese ladies are workaholic,they don't have time to reply message especially the ones in english which requires them additional time to interpret it.

If they receive a message from Brad Pitt then I doubt they would have trouble finding 5 minutes on their one hour train ride to reply.

And I don't think anyone is discussing rocket science with a girl Any Japanese person can answer simple English questions.

 

[Solong]

I feel like I shouldn't get racial about this topic, but I believe it is so prominent in Japanese culture. At least in the case of dating and relationships.

Ever since I have arrived here and started to explore around the country I've noticed something about couples here in Japan. It seems to me that there is some sort of hierarchy according to race, ranging from light to dark skin. Maybe it is the influences from European countries and others, I'm not sure. But I rarely see Japanese/Black(and it's subcategories) together. In the off chance that I do see a couple that falls in that category it's for the wrong reasons. Black males are usually portrayed as thugs/gangsters, dressing wildly(such as having pants below their waist), or anything else degrading. I imagine that Japanese have limited access to American television and only see the portrayals of people from America. Universally, this must happen because there are many misconstrued opinions of every country. This is how stereotypes come about, I guess.

I have to disagree with this, from years of observation in Japan. And if anyone has ever been to the American military bases, you can see a number of Black and Japanese couples, including children. Not to mention other racial and international combinations. They are only more obvious there because of the concentration, but there are other mix race and international combinations throughout Japan, with it of course being more likely to be seen or happen in cities.

You have to be careful with transplanting racial issues in say America, with what's going on in Japan. The history, ideology about race, and culture is different. I would say the hierarchy works more based on English speaking countries and those countries having higher GDP being preferred.

The Japanese arguably don't have an ideology of racial superiority or to oppress others based on color, but rather see things based more on nationality. Xenophobia versus racism, there they can be highly discriminatory against even other Asians or whoever isn't Japanese. The next spectrum after that is based on language, as who can or can't speak Japanese.

There is arguably some imported Western racist ideology based on skin color, but that's very hard to separate from what is marketing, a fad, and the selling of products. In many instances, there are Japanese that specifically like dark skin and Blacks, or are fans of famous Blacks.

Many Japanese clearly don't see themselves as White nor do White hate groups like the KKK accept Japanese or Asians. So this is a very mixed bag of what individual Japanese think, in terms of the race and color issues, and where nationalism and xenophobia are strong factors in such discussions.

Lastly, there are far more Japanese than there are dark skin and Blacks in Japan, meaning it shouldn't ordinarily be a problem to find Japanese that like them specifically or are open-minded about color. Therefore, I would look much more into the pick-up skills of the guy having the issue versus simply skin color.

 

[Odin]

I have to disagree with this, from years of observation in Japan. And if anyone has ever been to the American military bases, you can see a number of Black and Japanese couples, including children. Not to mention other racial and international combinations. They are only more obvious there because of the concentration, but there are other mix race and international combinations throughout Japan, with it of course being more likely to be seen or happen in cities.

You have to be careful with transplanting racial issues in say America, with what's going on in Japan. The history, ideology about race, and culture is different. I would say the hierarchy works more based on English speaking countries and those countries having higher GDP being preferred.

The Japanese arguably don't have an ideology of racial superiority or to oppress others based on color, but rather see things based more on nationality. Xenophobia versus racism, there they can be highly discriminatory against even other Asians or whoever isn't Japanese. They next spectrum after thar is based on language, as who can or can't speak Japanese.

There is arguably some imported Western racist ideology based on skin color, but that's very hard to separate from what is marketing, a fad, and the selling of products. In many instances, there are Japanese that specifically like dark skin and Blacks, or are fans of famous Blacks.

Many Japanese clearly don't see themselves as White nor do White hate groups like the KKK accept Japanese or Asians. So this is a very mixed bag of what individual Japanese think, in terms of the race and color issues, and where nationalism and xenophobia are strong factors in such discussions.

Lastly, there are far more Japanese than there are dark skin and Blacks in Japan, meaning it shouldn't ordinarily be a problem to find Japanese that like them specifically or are open-minded about color. Therefore, I would look much more into the pick-up skills of the guy having the issue versus simply skin color.

Looks like I just have to get my PUA game up then haha.