Michelin star restaurant or p4p?

[Frenchy]

Most of the Michelin stars restaurants I have eaten at in Tokyo have been over rated and underwhelming, especially the sushi places. Including Jiro. And Kyoto is even worse.

I tend to agree, and thats because some more reasonably priced restaurants here are very good too, even sometimes better. Well, same for P4P in fact

 

[warubuta]

I tend to agree, and thats because some more reasonably priced restaurants here are very good too, even sometimes better. Well, same for P4P in fact

I went to a Michelin star place in Kyoto some time back. It was one of these small places in a converted Machiya. French food with Japanese influence. It was one of these no choice eight course deals. The Main meat course was badger. That’s right badger. It was stewed in wine and all kinds of involved sauces, but it still tasted like a big greasy slimy rodent. Sometimes these Michelin chefs get too much positive encouragement. I washed the rodent down with an extra bottle of Opus One. It had to be done.

 

[Frenchy]

I went to a Michelin star place in Kyoto some time back. It was one of these small places in a converted Machiya. French food with Japanese influence. It was one of these no choice eight course deals. The Main meat course was badger. That’s right badger. It was stewed in wine and all kinds of involved sauces, but it still tasted like a big greasy slimy rodent. Sometimes these Michelin chefs get too much positive encouragement. I washed the rodent down with an extra bottle of Opus One. It had to be done.

With Opus One? Wow... that must have been the best-doused badger in history!

 

[MikeH]

I tend to agree, and thats because some more reasonably priced restaurants here are very good too, even sometimes better. Well, same for P4P in fact

As one travel guide put it, you can get amazing food in Japan if you can stop insisting to pay top yen for it.

The only time I have been at Jiro I think I paid 40k per person and it was as good as any other places I have paid 10k.

 

[warubuta]

With Opus One? Wow... that must have been the best-doused badger in history!

Overpriced wine to wash down overpriced badger. Would have rather had a nice piece of beef or lamb and a Phelps or Corison -which are better and half the price.

 

[warubuta]

As one travel guide put it, you can get amazing food in Japan if you can stop insisting to pay top yen for it.

The only time I have been at Jiro I think I paid 40k per person and it was as good as any other places I have paid 10k.

The most enjoyable sushi experiences I had was for a period of years I used to take friends to Midori Zushi in Umegaoka out on the Odakyu line. A pain to get to. Had to wait in line for a bit usually. But the sushi was really great. The atmosphere fantastic, and the price was absolutely reasonable. Thus the line. Hard to spend 10k per person. You might explode if you do. I certainly tried many times.

 

[jhingy567]

Taking restaurant recommendations from a tire company is already absurd. It's no wonder that sometimes you get an overpriced dish tasting like rodent meat.

 

[Frenchy]

Taking restaurant recommendations from a tire company is already absurd. It's no wonder that sometimes you get an overpriced dish tasting like rodent meat.

Well tbh they are still probably the most reliable, at least in their methodology. Blind visits only and all inspectors are paid by Michelin itself, not through kickback or advertising etc. The guide is more than 100 year old I think. Just a pet project of the Michelin family which became somehow more famous than their tires!

 

[faboo2001]

Sometimes these Michelin chefs get too much positive encouragement.

I've heard some chefs refuse the Michelin star for this very reason, not wanting to risk having it get to their heads and become complacent. That and they're probably already ok with the number of clientele and actually don't want the publicity from the award to attract more people.

As one travel guide put it, you can get amazing food in Japan if you can stop insisting to pay top yen for it.

The only time I have been at Jiro I think I paid 40k per person and it was as good as any other places I have paid 10k.

Very true. Been to a sit down place in Osaka for some wagyu beef and couldn't tell the difference from a standing restaurant in Akihabara that offers it for a fraction of the price.

 

[e-smile]

never been to any Michelin star restaurant and never been tempted to go
a home is the best place for me to enjoy food, when I eat outside it's either to just stop being hungry or to take out someone who wants to eat outside.
also I don't think any 40 000 yen steak would taste 40 times better than a stake that would cost me less than 1000 yen to make at home.

 

[MikeH]

also I don't think any 40 000 yen steak would taste 40 times better than a stake that would cost me less than 1000 yen to make at home.

I don't think that is the right way to measure things. Otherwise we could just stay at home for a wank and solo shower at the cost of 10 yen tissue instead of spending 20k for a soapland visit. Certainly it cannot be 2000 times better, right?

If you are a good cook yourself then it could be difficult to beat the taste only, but there is so much more in to eating out than that. Even everything else being equal you are not able to find a new girl you can try to chat up at the next table if you always eat at home.

Besides, none of the professional chefs I know never eat their own stuff, they look for inspiration and warnings on other chef's cookings.

 

[MelissaAnne]

I stayed at the Ritz-Carlton Hong Kong a few years ago, back when I used to have a Platinum Amex. I intended to use the certificate I got for booking through Amex Travel towards a meal at Tin Lung Heen (which has 2 stars), but I ended up not getting back from my wanderings on the Island until late. Instead, I just used it to get a burger from room service. I must say, though, the view looking out over Victoria Harbour from the 100-somethingth floor of the International Commerce Center made that burger taste amazing! Probably enjoyed it more than I would have the meal at Tin Lung Heen!

 

[namae]

I've heard some chefs refuse the Michelin star for this very reason, not wanting to risk having it get to their heads and become complacent. That and they're probably already ok with the number of clientele and actually don't want the publicity from the award to attract more people.

I don't think you can "refuse" the star ...... but suspect if you made enough negative noise about the Michelin guide they would probably quietly drop you off next years guide. I am sure the Tokyo restaurant scene would have been very happy to continue on as in the pre-Michelin guide days ..... an influx foreign "foodies" is not always a good thing for a restaurant.

 

[BB0523]

I had a nice lunch at Hinokizaka sushi at the Ritz Carlton yesterday... I think it's Michelin rated, but not sure. It was a birthday for my "Friend" and she enjoyed it very much. The sushi was good and service nice, details very nice and view was good. was it worth 40,000JPY... hmmmm I don't think it was TBH... but I could have gotten out cheaper if I had just ordered a bottle of wine instead of 6 glasses lesson learned. The afternoon was spent drinking water like crazy... don't know if it was the food or the workout after the lunch I don't mind paying for good food... what I find in Tokyo however, is that once you find a good restaurant with good food, they always change something and it goes down fast... has happened to me at least 4 times in recent years... I think all the French restaurants are way over rated.. glad that FB is gone... I also love when you go to a place and they have their Michelin rating from 10 yrs ago... scrape them off already...

 

[whocares]

I stayed at the Ritz-Carlton Hong Kong a few years ago, back when I used to have a Platinum Amex. I intended to use the certificate I got for booking through Amex Travel towards a meal at Tin Lung Heen (which has 2 stars), but I ended up not getting back from my wanderings on the Island until late. Instead, I just used it to get a burger from room service. I must say, though, the view looking out over Victoria Harbour from the 100-somethingth floor of the International Commerce Center made that burger taste amazing! Probably enjoyed it more than I would have the meal at Tin Lung Heen!

I ate at Tin Lung Heen in January...I've eaten better in Hong Kong at 1/10th the cost...aside from the actual restaurant being lovely with excellent service, the food was so overpriced as to be comical. After eating at three 2 (or above) michelin star restaurants in HKG, can honestly say I would never do it again. Ever. They seem to give michelin stars out like candy in Asia and I have yet to find one that was really deserving. I did not eat your burger but I'd put my life it was better than the mediocre crap I was served at TLH.

 

[Sudsy]

Taking restaurant recommendations from a tire company is already absurd.

I dunno... trucks and food have been associated since the advent of highways.

I mean, a restaurant with a parking lot full of big rigs means the food's worth stopping for.

Well, either that or the waitresses turn tricks in the john....

 

[MelissaAnne]

Actually, no... I'm mixing up the 2 meals I had there. The burger was for lunch the next day. For dinner, I had spaghetti bolognese.

That was the other plus to not going to TLH: I got 1 free and 1 cheap meal (IIRC, the voucher didn't quite cover the burger), whereas if I'd gone to TLH, the voucher might not have even covered the one meal.

 

[MikeH]

I mean, a restaurant with a parking lot full of big rigs means the food's worth stopping for.

I used to believe this too until I talked with one guy who had been driving those trucks for two decades. He told me it's more about the parking place than the food: "as long as I can drive right in without extra manoeuvres and the food is not bad that's my stop".

 

[Frenchy]

At the end of the day, food is just what you put in your mouth and sex is just... oh well, finish that sentence as you guys see fit

 

[Majestyk]

He told me it's more about the parking place than the food: "as long as I can drive right in without extra manoeuvres and the food is not bad that's my stop".

A girlfriend/regular has probably thought about me the same way, and vice versa.

 

[MikeH]

A girlfriend/regular has probably thought about me the same way, and vice versa.

Oh, my girls know I am totally a truck driver. Always willing to drive in any weather and will reliable get you to the destination whatever it takes.

 

[e-smile]

I don't think that is the right way to measure things. Otherwise we could just stay at home for a wank and solo shower at the cost of 10 yen tissue instead of spending 20k for a soapland visit. Certainly it cannot be 2000 times better, right?

If you are a good cook yourself then it could be difficult to beat the taste only, but there is so much more in to eating out than that. Even everything else being equal you are not able to find a new girl you can try to chat up at the next table if you always eat at home.

Besides, none of the professional chefs I know never eat their own stuff, they look for inspiration and warnings on other chef's cookings.

each one measure it the way he wants, I'm talking about me not saying how people should feel about it. and for me it works as long as I'm comparing a steak to a steak not an auto wank to a sex service, at least you could have compared it to a HJ service to be fairer (and yeah I wouldn't pay for a HJ).

I'm a OK cook I think, I enjoy my food and my friends enjoy it too but as I said I don't enjoy eating in public places surrounded by people I don't know. I only do that when I have to. I can appreciate drinking outside because the alcohol makes me less aware of those people but I've never been comfortable in restaurants and even if it costed the same as eating at home I wouldn't go more often than necessary.

 

[Frenchy]

each one measure it the way he wants, I'm talking about me not saying how people should feel about it. and for me it works as long as I'm comparing a steak to a steak not an auto wank to a sex service, at least you could have compared it to a HJ service to be fairer (and yeah I wouldn't pay for a HJ).

I'm a OK cook I think, I enjoy my food and my friends enjoy it too but as I said I don't enjoy eating in public places surrounded by people I don't know. I only do that when I have to. I can appreciate drinking outside because the alcohol makes me less aware of those people but I've never been comfortable in restaurants and even if it costed the same as eating at home I wouldn't go more often than necessary.

And strange enough , you are ok with sex in public though! I love contrarians!

 

[e-smile]

And strange enough , you are ok with sex in public though! I love contrarians!

then again the alcohol helps
never tried HP without nomihodai

 

[MikeH]

never tried HP without nomihodai

Hey, they do have nomihoudais in restaurants too!