Would You Date An Escort Or Other Type Of Sex Industry Worker?

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I don't really see the major objection here. I'd say most mongers out there don't have the hobby as a major part of their life, and to marry an active provider is a pretty drastic change in their lives. That's not necessarily a negative thing, but it is a big change. Contrast with a number of other careers. I enjoy going out for a drink, even regularly, but honestly I don't know if I'd want to marry someone that owned a bar. Or even careers that many see as positive- I don't know that I'd marry a police officer or someone in the military, for reasons that have nothing to do with 'what they do'. It has to do with the danger that they face and how it might affect me or our children. None of those are necessarily negative judgements on the people that are in those careers. I don't think RTG ever said "prostitutes are not fit to be mothers". He said he doesn't want the mother of his children to work as a prostitute.

It's not because I don't want to marry or have kids with a SW that I don't think they can be good wife or mother for someone else.

It's not because I don't like apple pie that every one should dislike apple pie too. It's just my own personal taste and no matter how much you might tell me you like apple pie it won't make it tastes good for me

Yes @meiji, it is *possible* that a man might not consider a sex worker a suitable mate or a suitable mother for his children for some mundane and benign reason that involves no negative judgements. And yes @Mr Cat, it is *possible* that it could be simply a matter of personal taste, like preferring peach pie to apple pie. This could be true in any individual case for all I know, and to be clear, I have *zero* interest in judging specific TAGers whom I've never met and almost certainly never will. Why would I care? Why would they care? Moreover, I of course totally agree that everyone can and should conduct their personal lives based on their own opinions and judgements.

But come on, guys; let's be real. In a world that so extremely disapproves of and severely stigmatizes sex work and sex workers, the *huge* majority of men who reject the possibility of a sex worker as a mate or a mother of their kids are certainly motivated by exactly that sort of disapproval and stigmatization, in other words by precisely such negative judgements. Surely no one would dispute that. And fwiiw (i.e., no one need particularly care what I think), I do judge those attitudes and values as cruel, hurtful, unjust, intolerant, unworthy and (in simple terms) bad. The reason I feel strongly about it is that I have seen "up close and personal" how much pain and harm such wide spread and harsh negative judgements cause to sex workers.

Moreover, I can absolutely assure you that virtually all sex workers would perceive a statement by a man that he would not want them to be a mother to his children as judgmental and hurtful, as meaning that he does not regard them as a good enough person to fulfill this very fundamental role in the lives of most women. Perhaps this is oversensitivity on their part, but if so, it is due to the fact that they have to live and function in a world so full of people who think ill of them for what they do.

And, of course, if the guy adds something like this:

In fact, the egotistical bastard I am, I have some more "rules ", which I expect conformity or will not proceed with a relationship. Smoking is a no go, trinking within reasonable limits, no drugs and no vegetarian/vegan whatsoever.

It would certainly reinforce the perception of a judgmental and disapproving attitude.

(The last item on RTG's list made me chuckle...the implication that being a vegetarian was a vice comparable to and perhaps worse than drugs, drinking, smoking etc. Horror of horrors, a vegan ! OMG!! :LOL: )

-Ww
 
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First off, in general, feminism isn't really about you setting boundaries with your girlfriend. Sexist double standards in society make it more difficult for women to get equal treatment at home (google studies about how much housework is done in each country based on gender), but generally, feminism isn't about measuring who can do what in a relationship. If you think your girlfriend is too demanding, choose another girl.

Secondly, there's an almost hilarious double-standard developing here in these threads. Here is the basic logic: female sex workers cannot be acceptable romantic partners or capable mothers because they have sex for money. This argument is supported by ideas of exclusivity and even evolutionary biology. Exclusivity, sex is an intimate and special act... yes, discussed on a MONGERING BOARD. Irony anyone? Evolutionary biology? I'm not a fan of these theories, but consider this: evolution has allowed humans to ALWAYS know who the mother is (they give birth), but gives us NO IDEA who the father is (women during ovulation tend to have higher sex drives so could have sex multiple times with possibly multiple partners, thus increasing chances of reproducing). According to evolutionary biology, men function mostly as a source of fertilization for the woman's eggs.

Lastly, how about swingers? Would anyone on TAG suggest that women who like to swing are not possible romantic dating material or unfit mothers? But they have sex with lots of different men and they ENJOY IT! In fact, probably a significant number of TAG men would love to date a woman who likes to swing. So is it then because sex workers get paid? Their horrible sin is to offer sexual services and GET PAID. No one answered J.Blair's excellent question regarding sex workers being unfit mothers: does that mean mongers (like ourselves) are unfit fathers? We exchange money for sex with many women. In both cases, what in particular about these activities makes someone unsuitable to be a parent? A single mom turning tricks to provide for her kids instead of making $7.50/hr at McDonald's to live on the edge of homelessness? Is she unfit to be a mother?

Here's where feminist analysis can be useful, to point out such obvious and unfounded double social/moral standards (read: UNEQUAL). Mongers on this board regularly pay for sex, do PUA, and brag about trying fuck almost anything with two legs and tits, AND they want to pass judgement and write off a group of women because these women provide sexual services to these very same mongers. Wow. The gap between logic and morality is a chasm.
 
No one answered J.Blair's excellent question regarding sex workers being unfit mothers: does that mean mongers (like ourselves) are unfit fathers?

A great post @Midlife Crisis! I am in strong agreement in general.

But it has one deep flaw; that was my question (quoted above), not @User#16452's! ;)

But, more seriously, I do think that the question deserves an answer from those who think sex workers make bad mothers.

-Ww
 
Evolutionary biology? I'm not a fan of these theories, but consider this: evolution has allowed humans to ALWAYS know who the mother is (they give birth), but gives us NO IDEA who the father is (women during ovulation tend to have higher sex drives so could have sex multiple times with possibly multiple partners, thus increasing chances of reproducing). According to evolutionary biology, men function mostly as a source of fertilization for the woman's eggs.

While the sexology theories I posted earlier focused on why it is in the man's favour for the woman to be monogamous, you are correct that is not in the woman's favour. Consider that women take longer to orgasm (men who ejaculate prematurely are actually the most evolved), a woman's vagina is acidic to ensure that only the strongest sperm can survive (i.e. it makes sense to have multiple partners to find the best) and that our closest relative, the bonobo, has multiple partners. Also, preforming oral sex on women supposedly has the purpose of scooping out the previous guy's sperm.

Consider also that when a woman has a child, it takes away nine months of fertility, as well as future resources for upbringing. It just doesn not make sense for her to not seek out the strongest and best avaliable sperm.
 
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My answer is no because of past personal experiences.
I think non Japanese sex workers in Japan are in a different situation & I've never had a personal relationship with one so I can't include them in my answer.
As far as Japanese sex workers, can't do it (on purpose).
Unlike non Japanese they usually have friends family etc that are reachable. While working in this environment anyone who knows or catches on is a threat.
I have dated at least 3 to 4 that worked in the industry, caught 1 red handed beforehand trying my best to just get the truth from her.
It's wouldn't be easy from the basic trust perspective, they usually will not tell you what they do. If you do know you will not have any ties with their real world people they cherish.
I'm not saying this is everyone but it seems common theme even on Japanese BBS with sex workers.
If the boyfriend finds out, quit & lie, or dump him.
If I'm dating/girlfriend I want sex to be between us. The activities I've done & reviews were while single & my past post even state I suddenly had interest in a few women & singled it down to one so I'm not being a hypocrite. I'd be cool with someone cutting loose ends in the first month or two.
I just don't think they can be honest to me, let me into their circle, & be intimate the way I like(just us).
 
Did anyone said sex workers aren't suitable to be good mothers?
I am searching but can't find such comments.
 
Did anyone said sex workers aren't suitable to be good mothers?
I am searching but can't find such comments.

I don't think that was said verbatim - it may have been insinuated, not directly on poin... It was said that some people don't want their kid's mother to be a prostitute.
 
First off, in general, feminism isn't really about you setting boundaries with your girlfriend. Sexist double standards in society make it more difficult for women to get equal treatment at home (google studies about how much housework is done in each country based on gender), but generally, feminism isn't about measuring who can do what in a relationship. If you think your girlfriend is too demanding, choose another girl.

Secondly, there's an almost hilarious double-standard developing here in these threads. Here is the basic logic: female sex workers cannot be acceptable romantic partners or capable mothers because they have sex for money. This argument is supported by ideas of exclusivity and even evolutionary biology. Exclusivity, sex is an intimate and special act... yes, discussed on a MONGERING BOARD. Irony anyone? Evolutionary biology? I'm not a fan of these theories, but consider this: evolution has allowed humans to ALWAYS know who the mother is (they give birth), but gives us NO IDEA who the father is (women during ovulation tend to have higher sex drives so could have sex multiple times with possibly multiple partners, thus increasing chances of reproducing). According to evolutionary biology, men function mostly as a source of fertilization for the woman's eggs.

Lastly, how about swingers? Would anyone on TAG suggest that women who like to swing are not possible romantic dating material or unfit mothers? But they have sex with lots of different men and they ENJOY IT! In fact, probably a significant number of TAG men would love to date a woman who likes to swing. So is it then because sex workers get paid? Their horrible sin is to offer sexual services and GET PAID. No one answered J.Blair's excellent question regarding sex workers being unfit mothers: does that mean mongers (like ourselves) are unfit fathers? We exchange money for sex with many women. In both cases, what in particular about these activities makes someone unsuitable to be a parent? A single mom turning tricks to provide for her kids instead of making $7.50/hr at McDonald's to live on the edge of homelessness? Is she unfit to be a mother?

Here's where feminist analysis can be useful, to point out such obvious and unfounded double social/moral standards (read: UNEQUAL). Mongers on this board regularly pay for sex, do PUA, and brag about trying fuck almost anything with two legs and tits, AND they want to pass judgement and write off a group of women because these women provide sexual services to these very same mongers. Wow. The gap between logic and morality is a chasm.

First off- No where did anybody define feminism as = boundaries set. What was stated is that men have just as much right to set boundaries in a relationship as women. Feminists make the claim that they are for equality, consequently they should support men's rights and equality too. Of course theory and reality are 2 different things.

And this applies to sexist double standards as well. Speaking of which, I don't remember: women being forced to sign up for the selective service and draft when they turn 18, men having any legal rights to stop women from aborting his child or giving away his child for adoption, given welfare, avoid jail for failure to pay child support, etc... Clearly many sexist double standards negatively impact men, and how about you use Google to enlighten yourself.

Second, stop with your red herrings and false equivalence arguments. Nobody said that sex workers can't be girlfriends or wives. Rather, men have the right to choose if they want to be in a relationship with such a woman. Furthermore, a monger is somebody engaging in sex for money occasionally or like a hobby, which is different from somebody that has sex for money as their main job or is the only marketable job skill that they have. Monger ≠ Sex Worker and Swinger ≠ Sex Worker, and if a person can't understand they aren't the same and different, they are purposely lying or trying to deceptively twist meanings to support a very poor argument.

What would be a better match is Male Porn Star or Gigolo = Female Sex Worker. And most women would arguably have as many reservations about being the girlfriend or wife of a male porn star or gigolo. Why? The woman can feel:

1) A person should have some education or value beyond selling their body

Yes, this is more of a moral judgement, that I personally would NOT make, but some people do. Furthermore, many people view lack of education or marketable job skill as a negative and the person's own fault. If you can do nothing but work at McDonald's then that's nobody's fault but your own. Same for sex work, if that is the only thing you can or want to do.

2) Embarrassed to tell friends and family that their significant other is a sex worker

This can also be a greater issue when introducing the sex worker to parents. People might be fine about lying about the type of work to friends, but lying to your parents is usually considered another level.

3) Feel that the STD risk is unacceptable

In the case of various types of sex workers, their exposure level could be very high, due to the number of customers serviced per day. Furthermore, the boyfriend/girlfriend or husband/wife would likely being using no condom in their intimate relationship. So if the sex worker had an accident or mistake and caught an STD, odds increase greatly to pass on to their intimate partners who they don't use condoms with, before it is realized or caught on a test. And no sex worker is tested every day.

4) Role model to children

A monger or swinger can stop or give up the activity at any time, and it's much easier to hide it. Where a sex worker can't or it would be extremely difficult to stop, as that's their money and main source of income. A sex worker isn't going to bring their child to work, and it's much more difficult to tell children that is what they should aspire to be.

Yes, some people would not have any issues with it, but both people in a relationship would need to agree on this. You or I can totally disagree with all the reasons given above, but it is not for us to decide what every person must do or think in regards to dating sex workers.

False Equivalence (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/False_equivalence). While you are at it, check out what a red herring is too.

You, my friend, are in desperate need of finding out what those means. You then threw in PUA, which has almost nothing to do with a man or woman deciding to have a relationship with a sex worker. No where did you read of any PUAs passing moral judgements on sex workers, nor would every PUA have the same opinion about them.

And then your grand finale- "The gap between logic and morality is a chasm." Really? Dude, I mean really? Please don't pawn off something you think might sound good or you pulled out of your ass, because that was totally irrelevant to the poor arguments you were trying to make.
 
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I don't think that was said verbatim - it may have been insinuated, not directly on poin... It was said that some people don't want their kid's mother to be a prostitute.

Yes and that is a completely different thing to say "I don't want the mother of my kids to be a prostitute " versus "prostitute aren't fit to be mothers "
You don't see the difference between those two ?
 
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Yes and that is a completely different thing to say "I don't want the mother of my kids to be a prostitute " versus "prostitute aren't fit to be mothers "
You don't see the difference between those two ?

Eh? Of course... I wasn't comparing.
 
My answer is no because of past personal experiences.
I think non Japanese sex workers in Japan are in a different situation & I've never had a personal relationship with one so I can't include them in my answer.
As far as Japanese sex workers, can't do it (on purpose).
Unlike non Japanese they usually have friends family etc that are reachable. While working in this environment anyone who knows or catches on is a threat.
I have dated at least 3 to 4 that worked in the industry, caught 1 red handed beforehand trying my best to just get the truth from her.
It's wouldn't be easy from the basic trust perspective, they usually will not tell you what they do. If you do know you will not have any ties with their real world people they cherish.
I'm not saying this is everyone but it seems common theme even on Japanese BBS with sex workers.
If the boyfriend finds out, quit & lie, or dump him.
If I'm dating/girlfriend I want sex to be between us. The activities I've done & reviews were while single & my past post even state I suddenly had interest in a few women & singled it down to one so I'm not being a hypocrite. I'd be cool with someone cutting loose ends in the first month or two.
I just don't think they can be honest to me, let me into their circle, & be intimate the way I like(just us).

I agree with parts of this. In my experience in Japan, many women want to keep anything embarrassing a secret. And being a sex worker, or many types of sexual activities and fetishes are high on the list. If the woman is trying to present a fake image, and the boyfriend gets too close to finding out or catches her, many Japanese women are GONE.

Because of my nature and experience, I've red handed caught several Japanese girlfriends, who were lying about their sexual history or lied about the type of job they really do. I was able to get crying confessions out of some, where they told about kinds of stuff. Like it being 10X worse than I thought and beyond just her lying about the type of job or type of woman she is. In one instance, I had to find out a Japanese girlfriend was married, doing sex work, and had sex with one of my pals on the same day. My head almost exploded.

In fact, there are a lot of women that are very preemptive about switching and dumping guys. They will ONS (one night stand) guys or dump the guys quickly after a short fling (a few weeks), to make sure guys have little to no chance of finding out her secrets or what she really does.
 
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Yes and that is a completely different thing to say "I don't want the mother of my kids to be a prostitute " versus "prostitute aren't fit to be mothers "
You don't see the difference between those two ?

I already addressed this in my post above which contains the following sentence:

And yes @Mr Cat, it is *possible* that it could be simply a matter of personal taste, like preferring peach pie to apple pie.

but I will be a bit more explicit now.

Yes, they are different statements. The former ("I don't want...") gives no explanation for the preference it expresses. The latter ("prostitutes aren't fit...") is the most reasonable *guess* at the explanation, the judgement/opinion motivating the preference, given the wide spread disapproval of sex work in the world.

Now you may well say that it isn't your personal motivation, that you hold no negative judgement of sex workers as mothers. If so, great! But it would be helpful if you explained why you wouldn't want the mother of your children to do sex work. What is the reason if it has nothing to do with the fitness of sex workers to be mothers? It would also be helpful if you told us some of the other professions which you would regard as unacceptable for the mother of your children. That might make your thinking clearer.

-Ww
 
@Wwanderer @User#16452 and some others
I unfortunately don't have the time to read through all the replies, but since I started it, I want to clarify one point.

I never intended and I still think I never said that a SW worker isn't fit as a mother. What I said is that I don't want the mother of my children to practice this trade at the time of raising our children.

I indeed consider it very detrimental to the child if the fact ever gets revealed. As most of you know, children can be very cruel for less reason and this is almost destined to make the child an outcast among it's group.

I also think it simply teaches the wrong values being a rather materialistic view where you can buy basically anything. There are probably jobs worse at that, but I can come up with few transporting that so easily understandable for children. There is a lot of discussion on how watching porn negatively affects childrens (I call teens here children too) in terms of relationships and sexuality and I think that SW) at least falls into a similar category that has a not a very well balanced influence.

We protect children from a lot of things that we don't consider a problem at adult age or at least can better judge and deal with as an adult.

Is a good mom defined by her job? By no means, I think that's more about her empathy, her love for the child and probably the ability to show this to the child. But some jobs create unfavorable circumstances. As a completely different example many parents (men and women) drastically cut down or quit work requiring lots of travel (less time with your child).

As a last comment @Wwanderer
Yes I indeed think that vegetarian or vegan lifestyle to me is detrimental to my happiness in a relationship and I speak of very rich experience here. I have not ended a relationship because of this nor demanded that partner to change, but drawn the conclusion to if possible not engage in further such relationships. It's not the same as drugs which would be a very valid reason to terminate. Depending on the circumstances and the relationship of course there is also the possibility of helping your partner get through it.
It's just an example of other requirements I put on potential long-term partner aside from exclusivity. A non vegetarian lifestyle is certainly not the hardest one. There is also not only black and white, but active SW is certainly among the deepest black in terms of exclusivity.

It is apparent that @User#16452 and I are no match for each other and my stance on exclusivity certainly wouldn't be the biggest obstacle here, but I would not rule out at all a former SW or one who is willing to change "career" upon engaging in a serious relationship. Unlike many other (maybe not here) I would have no problem with her history of hundreds or thousands of men.

Not everyone is idolizing this career as much as @User#16452 nor are most having such a grand career (earnings wise/ being at the upper end which I'm sure has a favorable impact on the type of encounter as well ), so I'm pretty sure you could find at least an even number looking for a way out compared to those wanting to stay till the age of 70.

It's not like I would force someone to change, but at one point you usually sit together and talk about future and then you find out whether you have common ground or not.
 
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My answer is no because of past personal experiences.
I think non Japanese sex workers in Japan are in a different situation & I've never had a personal relationship with one so I can't include them in my answer.
As far as Japanese sex workers, can't do it (on purpose).
Unlike non Japanese they usually have friends family etc that are reachable. While working in this environment anyone who knows or catches on is a threat.
I have dated at least 3 to 4 that worked in the industry, caught 1 red handed beforehand trying my best to just get the truth from her.
It's wouldn't be easy from the basic trust perspective, they usually will not tell you what they do. If you do know you will not have any ties with their real world people they cherish.
I'm not saying this is everyone but it seems common theme even on Japanese BBS with sex workers.
If the boyfriend finds out, quit & lie, or dump him.
If I'm dating/girlfriend I want sex to be between us. The activities I've done & reviews were while single & my past post even state I suddenly had interest in a few women & singled it down to one so I'm not being a hypocrite. I'd be cool with someone cutting loose ends in the first month or two.
I just don't think they can be honest to me, let me into their circle, & be intimate the way I like(just us).

@Desktop - Two points:

First, based on personal experiences, I can assure you that non-Japanese sex workers also very often (most often, I'd say) hide the fact from boyfriends and potential boyfriends, as well as family and friends, sometimes for extended periods. Off the top of my head I can think of at least three foreign sex workers in Tokyo whom I know to be doing exactly that. And they are even more likely to do it back in their home countries of course.

Second, isn't there a Catch-22 type problem here? You don't want to date (Japanese) sex workers because they hide what they do from you. OK, fair enough. BUT, how can you avoid dating them if they are hiding it and thus you are unaware of it??

-Ww
 
I already addressed this in my post above which contains the following sentence:



but I will be a bit more explicit now.

Yes, they are different statements. The former ("I don't want...") gives no explanation for the preference it expresses. The latter ("prostitutes aren't fit...") is the most reasonable *guess* at the explanation, the judgement/opinion motivating the preference, given the wide spread disapproval of sex work in the world.

Now you may well say that it isn't your personal motivation, that you hold no negative judgement of sex workers as mothers. If so, great! But it would be helpful if you explained why you wouldn't want the mother of your children to do sex work. What is the reason if it has nothing to do with the fitness of sex workers to be mothers? It would also be helpful if you told us some of the other professions which you would regard as unacceptable for the mother of your children. That might make your thinking clearer.

-Ww

I can't speak for Mr. Cat, but the difference should be understood once deeply thought about and obvious to some. Many people would not want the mother of their children to be a racing car driver, but be perfectly fine with other women who are mothers to be racing car drivers.

As a personal choice, the man or woman might feel that the job is too dangerous or they would be too worried. However where they can't accept the risk or it's against their personal moral codes, they can understand if other people can or have no issue with it. Personal preference.
 
Second, stop with your red herrings and false equivalence arguments. Nobody said that sex workers can't be girlfriends or wives. Rather, men have the right to choose if they want to be in a relationship with such a woman.

Red herrings did you say!? Where did anyone deny or question the right of men (or women) to choose whether or not they want to be in a relationship with a either a particular person or category of persons?? That would be absurd, and the topic is not even on the table.

Rather the questions are about the wisdom, fairness, hypocrisy, motivations etc of the choice. It turns out that people have the right to do many things that are not good, admirable or correct (in various senses) things to do, but to point that out is not to deny their right to do them.

But to avoid further confusion and for the record, let me state that I am strongly opposed to *forcing* men to marry sex workers or have children with them. :rolleyes:

-Ww
 
@Ww
Not really a catch 22. More like it wouldn't work out. Yes because of hiding what they do, usually the made up stories only last for so long. This creates the issues with trust.
Oh I'm a day trader, oh I don't have a job but I need to disappear every Wed - Friday nite until 11pm.
I'm not coming from home but before meeting you but I just smell like I came out the shower. I took a shower at my friends house that you will never meet etc.
During the day in populated areas I need to wear dark glasses & a big hat.
I've been around the block too.
I tried my best each time to just ask & get the truth. Not the situation I want to be in.
I want trust & yes I'm open to say listen I was seeing someone casually but that can change(if this was the situation).
I want to introduce them to my circle & as pointed out this most likely won't be mutual or happen at all.
From experience I'm seeing it wouldn't work out.
 
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Many people would not want the mother of their children to be a racing car driver, but be perfectly fine with other women who are mothers to be racing car drivers.

I think that is a very good comparison. I would like to stretch it even more to someone living of extreme sports (motor sports have become a lot more safe in recent years).
As long as it's only you and maybe your partner, a lot of risks become acceptable, but if dependables (children) come into play this often changes.
In some areas a SW may also be exposed a life/health risk, but I think when children come into play it's more the social risk. It's easy for an adult (maybe not easy, but doable) to deal with so called friends, colleagues etc. who can't accept / respect your gf/wife, but I feel it's asked too much of a 6 year old.

There are also a lot more complications in explaining your children what mom does or hiding it from them. It may work out all well and you might be able to manage everything just fine, but it may also seriously bite you in the ass. Some people may want to take a chance, I tend to not want to take unnecessary risk.

Call it double standard if you want, but we can only affect / form our environment to a certain degree and as long as there is a strong social bias against SW even in Japan (which along maybe Thailand is the country where it is most tolerated among countries I visited so far), you have to take such into consideration.
 
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@Wwanderer @User#16452 and some others
I unfortunately don't have the time to read through all the replies, but since I started it, I want to clarify one point.

I never intended and I still think I never said that a SW worker isn't fit as a mother. What I said is that I don't want the mother of my children to practice this trade at the time of raising our children.

I indeed consider it very detrimental to the child if the fact ever gets revealed. As most of you know, children can be very cruel for less reason and this is almost destined to make the child an outcast among it's group.

I think that is a very good comparison. I would like to stretch it even more to someone living of extreme sports (motor sports have become a lot more safe in recent years).

As long as it's only you and maybe your partner, a lot of risks become acceptable, but if dependables (children) come into play this often changes.
In some areas a SW may also be exposed a life/health risk, but I think when children come into play it's more the social risk. It's easy for an adult (maybe not easy, but doable) to deal with so called friends, colleagues etc. who can't accept / respect your gf/wife, but I feel it's asked too much of a 6 year old.

@RandomTokyoGuy - Thanks for taking the time and effort to further explain your views on the motherhood thing.

They do seem somewhat less harsh and judgmental than one might have thought from your previous posts. Although in my opinion you have mostly just explained the ways in which you think sex workers are not fit/suitable mothers, e.g., too great a risk of exposing their children to ostracism due to the social stigmatization of sex work, possible bad consequences of exposing them to the idea of making money from sex, too much risk of physical harm befalling their mother etc. While all you have said is that you would not want these risks for your own children, the strong implication is that a sex worker mother would be bad, less than ideal at least, for her children in all the same ways. In other words, if you think a sex worker mother would be bad for your children in the ways you explained, don't you also think she would be bad for any children she might have in all the same ways?

Two other comments:

- I don't follow your "at the time of raising our children" caveat in the context of your worry about exposing your children to stigmatization and ostracism and disapproval of friends and relatives etc...which appears to be your foremost concern (the one you list first for example). The reason this doesn't make sense to me is that this risk is hardly reduced if your children's mother was previously, rather than currently, a sex worker. The social consequences would be nearly the same for the children if it were found out. Perhaps if she did sex work far enough in the past or far enough away geographically, the chances of it being found out would be significantly reduced, but that would not normally be the case.

- As for the physical danger associated with sex work, it is indeed considerable in some places and for some types of sex work...but not much at all in other places and for other types/venues of sex work. Japan is, of course, a particularly safe environment for sex work, and I suspect that the additional danger associated with being a Tokyo sex worker, especially in an incall shop type situation, is very small compared to other risks we all routinely accept without giving them a thought. Of course it is totally normal and routine for people to fear perceived dangers that are actually very minor while ignoring much greater ones, but being common doesn't make it rational or sensible.

Before anyone starts getting excited, let me once more emphasize that I am NOT questioning your *right* to have these opinions or exercise your preferences about mates.

-Ww
 
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@Wwanderer
Just to not confuse things, I said that SW may be exposed to some physical danger as well in some areas, I was not particularly thinking of Japan here, but more of some generally more unsafe countries. Without having any specific knowledge about it and just based on the media coverage I would as an example consider India not a particular safe environment.

I do not consider physical harm one of the major risks a SW mother would be exposed to. Physical harm would be what an extreme sports would be exposed too.

I indeed think that social stigmatization is the main risk and I'm not talking about my friends or relatives here. May parents may not understand or be 100% happy with such a choice, but I'm very sure would accept. Anyone else who cannot deal with it I would cut lose. I'm concerned about the playmates/classmates of the child. A child is w child and much less prepared to deal with such narrow minded views. Furthermore among children there is very often a dynamic to gather against the weak, so this can create immense negative impact.

I seriously think it makes a big difference if she is a previous or current sex worker. You are probably right that you don't want to live next to the place where she worked for 10 years.

And yes I think you may run into situations where your daughter may want to use her body in exchange for money or other benefits and your boy may simply think about offering that sexy girl next door 20$ for a bj and you may or may not be able to solve that well.

However my main concernregarding values , and you may call me idealistic, is that I don't believe that money makes you happy. It can help to a certain degree, but I would be happy for my children to at least not start out with a very materialistic world view. Call that a soft concern. As parent you can of course try to counter that.

And yes, I don't want my children to become SW. I don't consider it an ideal career and I'm sure @User#16452 would disagree, if she considers having children at one point of her life. Not because of the social stigmatization, that would be her choice, but because I see it as somewhat unreliable (anything that negatively affects appearance be it accidents, diseases etc. is absolutely detrimental), not long-term (I know a few rare cases exceed all age limits) and potentially detrimental to forming a relationship.

Will a daughter or a sun automatically become SW just because the mother is one? I don't think so, the opposite direction in becoming a nun or a monk may be equally likely ;)

I already stated in my previous post that I don't define a good or fit mom by their job, but the job can add a lot of complications to raising your children. That is not only true for SW, there are countries where being an prosecutor, judge or even attorney can expose your family to enormous risk etc.
In contrast I assume it would maybe not be such a problem for a mom to be a SW in Thailand for example. From hearsay it's pretty common there, even if you may not brag about it. And probably not if you are high society.
 
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@RandomTokyoGuy - Well, I think we have just about teased out as many details and as much clarity on this item of sex worker (or ex sex worker) motherhood as seems attainable. So, I have only a couple more things to say.

First, I'd be very interested in hearing your answer to this question from my previous post (to which I have added some bold font for emphasis and clarity):

In other words, if you think a sex worker mother would be bad for your children in the ways you explained, don't you also think she would be bad for any children she might have in all the same ways?

Second, on your central concern (with some more bold font added):

I indeed think that social stigmatization is the main risk and I'm not talking about my friends or relatives here. May parents may not understand or be 100% happy with such a choice, but I'm very sure would accept. Anyone else who cannot deal with it I would cut lose. I'm concerned about the playmates/classmates of the child. A child is w child and much less prepared to deal with such narrow minded views. Furthermore among children there is very often a dynamic to gather against the weak, so this can create immense negative impact.

I would say that this is indeed true, horribly and far too frequently true in fact. However, I am also fairly certain (let me not explain why here) that the targets/victims of such vicious bullying and persecution are almost entirely determined by the individual personalities of the children and *not* by any objective fact about their circumstances or lives or whatever. If your child is one of the "weak" ones (as you phrase it, not exactly the right term imo), he/she can and will be just as viciously attacked (in a social and sometime physical sense) by the group over the style of his/her clothing or the size of his/her ears or almost anything at all as about how his/her parents make a living (though that would work just as well as anything else). On the other hand, if the child is one of the "strong" ones (again not an ideal term imo, but you know what I mean), *exactly* the same differences that cause a "weak" one to be targeted will cause him/her to be admired and respected as "cool" or a self-confident leader or whatever.

In short, if you want to be sure your child does not suffer the (indeed horrible) experiences of being a despised outcast in his/her childhood social circles, it will be enormously more effective to try to make sure that he/she is able to effectively socialize with other children and knows how to maintain a reasonably high position in the "pecking order" of a group of children than to try to make sure that there is nothing about him/her that other children might attack. The former is not necessarily easy (depends on the child's intrinsic personality), but the latter is pretty much impossible.

Finally, it occurs to me that a SW-mother is probably better equipped than most moms to teacher her children how to deal with social disapproval (due to her own life experiences). If I were in your shoes and had the same concerns, I would probably reach the opposite conclusion about the desirability of having a sex worker be mother of my children!

-Ww
 
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I would have no problem dating her.
Marrying...? hhm.. maybe.. Would depend on how I felt at the time I think.
 
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