Catfished in a BIG Way, aka, Bait and Switch

[Fluvveh]

You are fine with a 4wd and also a minivan, we've established that already. It's just not the one thing you put on some form and that makes you mad.

So you turn down a transaction that you are happy to make on the premise that if you and everyone else rejects it then it might eventually be more honest? Not better, just more honest.


They provide minivans because it turns out you (and everyone else) like minivans just as much. Those bastards.

I call I ask for a specific person and they ok it. They just lied to you and then instead of telling she isn't available or calling you back to say so they send a completely different person without consulting you for your input in whether you want to complete the transaction or pick someone else it's at that point they don't even give you an option and they intend to do that to you from the start.
The whole operation is a shit show and the best you can do for yourself and every other consumer is to refuse service so that these businesses will be shut down or change the way they do business
Ya you yourself alone can say that particular girl is fine but what about the next person? It's not horrible to just say no what's the worst that could happen? You don't get your dick wet that night? The more likely scenario is you call a different agency there are other options.

 

[MikeH]

Those bastards.

I hope next time you order a petite girl they send you a big guy. He can then argue that as FS is illegal anyway you should not expect it but you can get AF instead.

And that it's actually better as you can get in both ways, real 4WD!

 

[akasam]

They just lied to you.

OMG. Thank you for taking such a principled stand. Those bastards almost provided you with a girl you were attracted to for a price you thought was reasonable. You showed them!

 

[akasam]

I hope next time you order a petite girl they send you a big guy. He can then argue that as FS is illegal anyway you should not expect it but you can get AF instead.

I'll entertain your premise that you are just as happy with that dude as the girl you originally ordered. Now, please explain to me again how you are harmed by saying yes to this arrangement?

Barring that, I'll just wait until tomorrow when hopefully there will be at least one or two people who can understand the fucking premise in question.

 

[Fluvveh]

OMG. Thank you for taking such a principled stand. Those bastards almost provided you with a girl you were attracted to for a price you thought was reasonable. You showed them!

Ya and I can get the girl I asked for for a reasonable price somewhere else

 

[Fluvveh]

I'll entertain your premise that you are just as happy with that dude as the girl you originally ordered. Now, please explain to me again how you are harmed by saying yes to this arrangement?

Barring that, I'll just wait until tomorrow when hopefully there will be at least one or two people who can understand the fucking premise in question.

We get that you're fine with shitty business practices and would gladly help perpetuate them.
Where are you from? China?

 

[RandomTokyoGuy]

I generally agree with both @e-smile and @MikeH, however on a few occasions I got a switch that I felt was an upgrade, in a few cases even a significant one. I'm not moralist enough to turn that down.

Sometimes I will also accept it, if I'm regular at a shop and it's and exception on good intention (original girl dropped out on short notice ).

 

[RandomTokyoGuy]

@akasam
Your rental car is not a good example. If you take a rental car, you usually have to go from A to B. There is no option not to go and oftentimes there is no choice to go by other means.
On the contrary there are tons of options to provide you sexual relief including your right hand or you could simply skip that day.

Going back to your example, if I order a sports car, I do it for acceleration and top speed. Neither is provided by a 4WD or a minivan. So if I had to accept such a substitute I would at least expect a discount.
Furthermore, and that's what makes it a somewhat good example, while many people like 4WD, I rather despise them. Something the rental company can't know unless you are a regular.
So your dh randomly switching the girl might just send someone who is absolutely no match for you, even if she is quite popular. That's why we nominate (girls, cars) in the first place.

 

[MikeH]

Barring that, I'll just wait until tomorrow when hopefully there will be at least one or two people who can understand the fucking premise in question.

I am not a doctor but if you continue your style of explanations I would not recommend holding your breath while you are waiting someone to understand you.

 

[DocMcStuffins]

This thread is really interesting, with opinions all over the place. The OP was catfished, but he'd somehow be willing to repeat. Others would reject the girl in principle.

My guess is if a guy was horny, sitting in a LH in his undies, most would not reject a suitable replacement. Blue ball avoidance is a biological survival instinct.

I think the best you can hope for is to give feedback to the shop on why you won't repeat.

 

[whocares]

Aksam...the problem is you aren't seeing the flaw in your premise...the entire point of the bait/switch scam is that the shop does not have a girl equally or more attractive than the one you actually wanted or they would advertise that girl...i.e. the entire idea is to rent you a Ferrari and then deliver at GMC pacer.

The rental car example is a bad one because the rental car company will never make you an offer that isn't to your benefit...i.e they will either upgrade you for free if they don't have the car you ordered or downgrade you but with a bunch of additional perks, also they don't intentionally lie, they just sometimes have issues with inventory management and have to eat some costs by giving you a better car or a discount or whatever. So, sure, you might end up with free GPS or free extra insurance or driving a Cadillac for the price of a Ford Taurus but, generally speaking, that's better than whatever option you ordered. Also, as Mike said, you need the rental car.

I don't think anyone is really saying that if Kate Upton showed up and you ordered Kathy Griffin that they would tell Kate to take a hike (although I get the principle of doing such), but rather that's like winning the lottery and cannot be banked upon (not to mention that you might genuinely have a thing for Kathy Griffin)...the bait/switch is designed to give you something you didn't order, just because 1/10000 you might prefer or be ok with the result, doesn't make it a good thing.

 

[akasam]

@akasam
Your rental car is not a good example. If you take a rental car, you usually have to go from A to B. There is no option not to go and oftentimes there is no choice to go by other means.
On the contrary there are tons of options to provide you sexual relief including your right hand or you could simply skip that day.

Everywhere I rent a car there are half a dozen other car rental companies nearby. Even if they don't have what you want you can take a cab, a bus, etc.

There are always other options, not always convenient ones. It's exactly the same.

Going back to your example, if I order a sports car, I do it for acceleration and top speed. Neither is provided by a 4WD or a minivan. So if I had to accept such a substitute I would at least expect a discount.
Furthermore, and that's what makes it a somewhat good example, while many people like 4WD, I rather despise them. Something the rental company can't know unless you are a regular.

If you don't like 4wd then nobody is telling you to take it. What you are arguing is that if you booked a Corvette and they gave you a Boxster, you would still refuse it, even though you'd be equally happy with the Boxster.

So your dh randomly switching the girl might just send someone who is absolutely no match for you, even if she is quite popular. That's why we nominate (girls, cars) in the first place.

If you nominate a girl because of some unique quality that you NEED, then fine. No one they send will be a decent replacement for her, so by all means send her back. However, again, what you are talking about is sending back a girl who is just as fine as the one you asked for, JUST ON PRINCIPLE.

 

[DocMcStuffins]

I don't think the rental car example works.

Maybe heroin addict? If you need your fix, will you turn down an offered alternative?

 

[Fluvveh]

I don't think the rental car example works.

Maybe heroin addict? If you need your fix, will you turn down an offered alternative?

That's an even worse example. That implies addiction.

Edit: its also not an alternative if they never had your original fix to begin with

 

[akasam]

Aksam...the problem is you aren't seeing the flaw in your premise...the entire point of the bait/switch scam is that the shop does not have a girl equally or more attractive than the one you actually wanted or they would advertise that girl...i.e. the entire idea is to rent you a Ferrari and then deliver at GMC pacer.

To be clear it is not MY premise. I am arguing with the suggestion that you should ALWAYS send a different girl back, even if you're happy with her.

The rental car example is a bad one because the rental car company will never make you an offer that isn't to your benefit...i.e they will either upgrade you for free

Not in my experience. They will offer you what THEY think is a reasonable equivalent. I've been offered a Prius instead of a Corolla. I can see YOU rejecting that for a number of reasons, but I had never driven a Prius and I was totally fine with it. I didn't reject it or demand further compensation, because again, it was just as good for me at that time.

also they don't intentionally lie,

Giving you a reservation and not keeping it is intentionally lying. To quote a great sage: "You see, you know how to *take* the reservation, you just don't know how to *hold* the reservation. And that's really the most important part of the reservation: the holding."

The question is what you do about it. Cause a fuss and inconvenience yourself, on principle, or just go with it.

the bait/switch is designed to give you something you didn't order, just because 1/10000 you might prefer or be ok with the result, doesn't make it a good thing.

It's not a good thing and if 9,999 rejected the girl it would be a terrible business model and a terrible waste of time for everyone involved. But sending a girl they honestly think is just as good is not that.

 

[whocares]

The bait/switch is not designed for them to think "oh Tulip is a lovely gal, surely the gent will like her"...the scam is to put up photos of gorgeous ladies and then send non-gorgeous ladies...that's the entire point...

And it's not a terrible business model because people keep accepting the new woman! That is the point everyone is making. If you order steak and they deliver sole and everyone says "fuck that, I ordered steak" then they would never ever put steak on the menu and everyone would get what they actually wanted.

People accepting the different lady just propagates the whole shitty system where nobody has any idea if right lady is going to show up. If every single person who ordered a gal on backpage and had a different lady show up said "fuck off, go away" backpage would be honest in a week. Nobody would put up a fake ad because there would be no point.

 

[Fluvveh]

>still comparing girls to rental cars

 

[Fluvveh]

Here's a better question. Would you go to one of these places knowing what you know now. that you will definitely not get you the girl you asked for?

 

[akasam]

What would a Japanese guy do in this situation? My impression is that most would make the best of it and not cause a big scene. They may never use the service again, they may note or even complain about the switcheroo on a message board, but that's it. Many of you should know better than I do, I just don't think you care.

Yet people wonder why gaijin are so often rejected at Japanese establishments.

I've seen this kind of attitude from tourists around the world. People making "principled" stands (on message boards, at least) about not standing for the foreigner tax, not ruining the market by over tipping, about making a fuss when turned away from a locals only club, ... There are countless examples.

"If only we ALL do this, they will change. We can do it!"

BS. It doesn't change, you're just on a pointless personal crusade and you just look like assholes to everyone involved.

 

[akasam]

People accepting the different lady just propagates the whole shitty system where nobody has any idea if right lady is going to show up. If every single person who ordered a gal on backpage and had a different lady show up said "fuck off, go away" backpage would be honest in a week. Nobody would put up a fake ad because there would be no point.

I wrote my last post before reading this, but you sure exemplified what I was talking about. (Although, I wouldn't have been so blunt in my reply if I'd seen this first.)

 

[akasam]

And it's not a terrible business model because people keep accepting the new woman! That is the point everyone is making. If you order steak and they deliver sole and everyone says "fuck that, I ordered steak" then they would never ever put steak on the menu and everyone would get what they actually wanted.

If only there were some sort of forum where people could talk about which businesses provided quality service and which don't.

 

[akasam]

Here's a better question. Would you go to one of these places knowing what you know now. that you will definitely not get you the girl you asked for?

Would I go to a place where I don't get to pick the exact girl I want? Sure, I've done it before and I imagine the same is true for just about every active forum member.

 

[Fluvveh]

Would I go to a place where I don't get to pick the exact girl I want? Sure, I've done it before and I imagine the same is true for just about every active forum member.

Wow. Way to not answer the question.

 

[akasam]

Wow. Way to not answer the question.

You asked if I would go to a place where I don't get to nominate the girl. What relevant detail do you think I overlooked?

 

[MikeH]

What would a Japanese guy do in this situation? My impression is that most would make the best of it and not cause a big scene.

My guess is most people, Japanese or not, would just take it and not make a scene. But I do then know also Japanese guys who would, especially if the agency was a higher class place, to make a very big scene indeed.

Yet people wonder why gaijin are so often rejected at Japanese establishments.

I think most of the people in this forum fully understand the reasons why foreigners are often rejected. None of those reasons is they will not accept bait and switch.

I've seen this kind of attitude from tourists around the world. People making "principled" stands (on message boards, at least) about not standing for the foreigner tax, not ruining the market by over tipping, about making a fuss when turned away from a locals only club, ...

BS. It doesn't change, you're just on a pointless personal crusade and you just look like assholes to everyone involved.

Well, in my opinion a man needs to have his principles to be a man. Otherwise you are just a doormat. Of course it would be better if those principles would be sensible but you can't always have everything.

I am one of those who refuse to patronise places that have gaijin tax. I totally understand it sometimes causes me to miss a good deal, but that's the price I am willing to take. But with that it is also easier as those places normally advertise openly their prices; they don't try to lure you in with cheaper prices and then just slap you with additional prices after you order. So I can just choose not to go there, no scene and no fuss.

I think the misassumption you make is that you need to act as an asshole if you reject a girl. But you can do it also politely, telling that the pics were totally different so you changed your mind. As both the girl and the agency know very well what they are doing they also understand the reason for the cancellation. And then they can make the most of the situation and not cause a big scene.