Life In Japan - The Low Points

[User#8628]

Seriously, those guys dont fear body contact.

 

[rick]

Seriously, those guys dont fear body contact.

I don't doubt it!
It must be hard to be a white/black/obviously not Japanese person in Japan...

When I'm in Paris I always get accosted by those fucking Romas.
Gotta keep my hands in my pockets so they don't steal my shit too.

 

[e-smile]

I just remembered something else i dont like, the nigerians (i think theyre nigerians) in roppongi. They just cant seem to take no for an answer, and on occasion they can get a bit aggressive.

yeah they are nigerian. I spoke to many of them.

 

[e-smile]

I don't doubt it!
It must be hard to be a white/black/obviously not Japanese person in Japan...

When I'm in Paris I always get accosted by those fucking Romas.
Gotta keep my hands in my pockets so they don't steal my shit too.

dislike

 

[rick]

dislike

So, you defend Romas that pick pockets, ask you to sign petitions as a distraction, steal from ladies' handbags, put bracelets on you and scream for money?

Not to mention they jump gates for the metro or force their way in past other people. The list can go on and on.

But nope, poor Romas living a life of crime and leeching off the hardworking Parisians and innocent tourists.

Explain that...

If you feel slighted because you are a Romanian, understand that the term refers to all those who engage in scummy behaviour, regardless of origin.

 

[RandomTokyoGuy]

@deckard
You should first understand that Romanian and Roma (or Romani) are not the same. The first is the population of a country and the second an ethnic group which is widespread (but always a minority) in Europe, but also has significant population in the US or south America due to migration.
The later is probably what you refer to and it's a group heavily discriminated by society in many countries.
There are obviously problems with some people from those ethnic group running trickery schemes mainly in southern European tourist spots, but the generalization based just on the ethnic group is plain wrong.
Obviously poverty and lack of future prospects is one main reason for drawing people into criminal activities. If that is a result of discrimination and prejudices against a certain group, one could argue whose fault it is.

 

[TAG Manager]

Pardon the ignorance: when I was in Paris a couple times, I'd get approached by people that were referred to as gypsies. My French friend said they were known for thievery such as pick pockets and asking for money to help some sick family member...

Is this what is being referred to as 'Roma' above?

 

[RandomTokyoGuy]

Gypsy is another term often used for Roma, but it's frowned upon as it basically implies criminal activity (at least that's what I was told). But yes, it's the people @deckard was referring too. There are however a lot of non-gypsies running similar schemes mainly from Eastern Europe.

 

[TAG Manager]

Gypsy is another term often used for Roma, but it's frowned upon as it basically implies criminal activity (at least that's what I was told). But yes, it's the people @deckard was referring too. There are however a lot of non-gypsies running similar schemes mainly from Eastern Europe.

Gotcha - thanks. That was the term used to describe to me by a local French person when we were approached by a woman wearing kind of ragged clothes around the tower grounds -- I had heard the term before, but it had a different meaning. (i.e. Gypsy fortune teller!) Well, whatever they are or wherever they are from, I can understand if they've got problems... but their reputation at least in Paris is quite negative. Overall, I had about six encounters during my trips to Paris.

 

[RandomTokyoGuy]

They are an ethnic group that used (and partially still does) live a nomadic lifestyle far beyond the ages when people settled down in Europe. Guess they would also been called the traveling folks.
If for example you look at the opera Carmen, they have been associated with shady business like smuggling since long ago.

 

[vondoom]

people suspect them everywhere of pick pocketing, thievery and arson... still its not okay to generalise...
btw is there any country in the world where people on train stations are not rude? i would be surprised if id experience that one day...
the term also doesnt refer "to all those who engage in scummy behaviour, regardless of origin", but to an ethnic group... nowadays people just use it as a derogative term...

 

[e-smile]

So, you defend Romas that pick pockets, ask you to sign petitions as a distraction, steal from ladies' handbags, put bracelets on you and scream for money?

Not to mention they jump gates for the metro or force their way in past other people. The list can go on and on.

But nope, poor Romas living a life of crime and leeching off the hardworking Parisians and innocent tourists.

Explain that...

If you feel slighted because you are a Romanian, understand that the term refers to all those who engage in scummy behaviour, regardless of origin.

I don't defend thiefs, and there are thiefs from every nationality. you didn't insult thiefs, you insulted a whole people.
and I'm not romanian, I would have reacted the same if a read a comment of someone complaining about racist french peole and said a general comment like "those fucking french".

 

[e-smile]

Pardon the ignorance: when I was in Paris a couple times, I'd get approached by people that were referred to as gypsies. My French friend said they were known for thievery such as pick pockets and asking for money to help some sick family member...

Is this what is being referred to as 'Roma' above?

yeah, there a lot of beggars and pick pockets in the subways in Paris whom are gypsies.
but that doesn't mean you have to hate a whole ethnic group.
it's just like insulting all the nigerian people because the ones you see in Roppongi are rude.

 

[e-smile]

Gotcha - thanks. That was the term used to describe to me by a local French person when we were approached by a woman wearing kind of ragged clothes around the tower grounds -- I had heard the term before, but it had a different meaning. (i.e. Gypsy fortune teller!) Well, whatever they are or wherever they are from, I can understand if they've got problems... but their reputation at least in Paris is quite negative. Overall, I had about six encounters during my trips to Paris.

I've lived in Paris for 3 years and I've seen a lot of them but never been robbed by them. those I've seen were mainly beggars so I only felt sorry for them and a little angry by the fact they used children to get more pitty but I've never had a bad experience with them.
I had bad experiences with some french people though but I'd never generalise. there are scumbags and nice people every where.

 

[vondoom]

deckard is a spoiled child and nothing more... didnt even learn from his alcohol/cigarette thread^^

 

[rick]

I will readily admit that I am prejudiced against Romas/gypsies because of my experiences.
My friend was robbed of all her cash during her stay in Paris, and I lost a rather expensive lighter.
If you haven't felt the effects of these people, I understand your pity. It's all very nice to say, well, these people were forced into this life, but it doesn't change the fact that they engage in actions that hurt people.

As for generalising, you can always say "But not everyone does X!!", it doesn't mean that the generalisation doesn't hold true for the majority.
If I say Japanese people are polite, I'm sure somebody will reply and say "I had so many experiences with rude Japanese people!", etc.
It doesn't change the fact that most Japanese are very polite, especially relative to the rest of the world.

And as for @vondoom , I felt no obligation to reply to your comment about me ridiculing a clerk, simply because it was obviously baseless and untrue. Besides, you and Damian completely missed the point of that post. Why adulterate my posts with your own assumptions?
I will set the record straight, I have nothing but the utmost respect for those who work hard, no matter what their job is.
If you fail to understand my intentions, you might wish to clarify them before making a fool of yourself (as you are prone to doing).

 

[rick]

people suspect them everywhere of pick pocketing, thievery and arson... still its not okay to generalise...
btw is there any country in the world where people on train stations are not rude? i would be surprised if id experience that one day...
the term also doesnt refer "to all those who engage in scummy behaviour, regardless of origin", but to an ethnic group... nowadays people just use it as a derogative term...

Have you even been to Paris?
They aren't just on the train stations, they are everywhere.
I'm not sure you understand what I meant either. They jump the ticket gates to avoid paying fares, or jostle behind you. Imagine in Tokyo if you tapped your card and someone squeezed up behind you to avoid paying the fare.
You can't walk down the Avenue des Champs-Élysées without somebody walking up to you trying to pick your pocket.

Just a god damned annoyance.

 

[User#6541]

I will readily admit that I am prejudiced against Romas/gypsies because of my experiences.
My friend was robbed of all her cash during her stay in Paris, and I lost a rather expensive lighter.
If you haven't felt the effects of these people, I understand your pity. It's all very nice to say, well, these people were forced into this life, but it doesn't change the fact that they engage in actions that hurt people.

As for generalising, you can always say "But not everyone does X!!", it doesn't mean that the generalisation doesn't hold true for the majority.
If I say Japanese people are polite, I'm sure somebody will reply and say "I had so many experiences with rude Japanese people!", etc.
It doesn't change the fact that most Japanese are very polite, especially relative to the rest of the world.

And as for @vondoom , I felt no obligation to reply to your comment about me ridiculing a clerk, simply because it was obviously baseless and untrue. Besides, you and Damian completely missed the point of that post. Why adulterate my posts with your own assumptions?
I will set the record straight, I have nothing but the utmost respect for those who work hard, no matter what their job is.
If you fail to understand my intentions, you might wish to clarify them before making a fool of yourself (as you are prone to doing).

Now sure why you mention me here, but if you read that thread again, you will notice that my first attempt was to understand you by asking what you meant with that phrase.
Just to follow up stating that all assumptions, mine and yours, are wrong.
I did not adulterate anything, I did not understand and I asked.

I'm sure you are a nice kid in real life, sometimes you just write with too much passion, that's all.

 

[roots reggae]

deckard is a spoiled child and nothing more... didnt even learn from his alcohol/cigarette thread^^

Yes, @vondoom, Deckard may come off as a "spoiled child," and perhaps he is. It's hard to really know someone from their online personality.

He readily admits his youthful nature. Mercy, looking back at my life, I, too, was obstinate, especially when challenged. Fortunately, most humans learn from experience, or in some cases do not. Those that benefit from acquired knowledge go on to become productive members of society and contribute to the overall good.

Those that do not learn from their mistakes, either slowly burn or melt down quickly-in poverty, isolated lives, or the cemetery.

There's a lot I don't know, but I do know this... People respond defensively when insulted and are resistant to change.

Deckard is at a crucial stage in his life, one that involves risk-taking and experimentation. It's because of his developmental stage and is strongly related to brain development. Read this for a bit more info:

http://nancyguberti.com/5-stages-of-human-brain-development/

I also know this-for his age, Deckard possesses superior thought processes and a talent for written expression. Let's try to nurture his inter-actions so that they are positive rather than risk another "He-Who-Must-Not-Be-Named." We all witnessed his painful melt-down- one, that, even I had no tolerance nor sympathy.

 

[User#6541]

Yes, @vondoom, Deckard may come off as a "spoiled child," and perhaps he is. It's hard to really know someone from their online personality.

He readily admits his youthful nature. Mercy, looking back at my life, I, too, was obstinate, especially when challenged. Fortunately, most humans learn from experience, or in some cases do not. Those that benefit from acquired knowledge go on to become productive members of society and contribute to the overall good.

Those that do not learn from their mistakes, either slowly burn or melt down quickly-in poverty, isolated lives, or the cemetery.

There's a lot I don't know, but I do know this... People respond defensively when insulted and are resistant to change.

Deckard is at a crucial stage in his life, one that involves risk-taking and experimentation. It's because of his developmental stage and is strongly related to brain development. Read this for a bit more info:

http://nancyguberti.com/5-stages-of-human-brain-development/

I also know this-for his age, Deckard possesses superior thought processes and a talent for written expression. Let's try to nurture his inter-actions so that they are positive rather than risk another "He-Who-Must-Not-Be-Named." We all witnessed his painful melt-down- one, that, even I had no more tolerance for.

You know , I had to ask around who you were referring to with "He-Who-Must-Not-Be-Named."

And as I said some posts ago, I somehow understand @deckard , I was 20 at some point also. And probably much more of an asshole.

 

[roots reggae]

You know , I had to ask around who you were referring to with "He-Who-Must-Not-Be-Named."

And as I said some posts ago, I somehow understand @deckard , I was 20 at some point also. And probably much more of an asshole.

For newcomers:
Go to the members tab.
Scroll down in the most messages
Look for 874 posts
Type his name in the search for members. You can spend the whole weekend,nay week, being both entertained and horrified.

 

[rick]

Now sure why you mention me here, but if you read that thread again, you will notice that my first attempt was to understand you by asking what you meant with that phrase.
Just to follow up stating that all assumptions, mine and yours, are wrong.
I did not adulterate anything, I did not understand and I asked.

I'm sure you are a nice kid in real life, sometimes you just write with too much passion, that's all.

Thanks for your and @roots reggae 's words

I had just come off a long flight last post and was in no mood to join the PC parade, hence the heated words.
I still stand by what I said, but I admit that I could have said it better.

Yes, I read the thread, and I saw that your intentions were well.
I think I responded too energetically, but I would have responded the same way to a friend.
Unfortunately, many things do not come across in written expression the way they might in a conversation.
It can be very off putting for other people, and I think you were annoyed too because it sounded overly confrontational.
It was a mistake referring to you from that thread, and I apologise for that.

It really depends on how much alcohol is in me as well, and like I mentioned in that thread I was rather drunk.

I do appreciate all your words, even from people like vondoom; it helps me expand my world view.
(That doesn't make what you say any more valid)

Sometimes I have to remind myself that certain people are just brain dead in the logic department, and that I'm often too hot blooded than I care to admit.

 

[patty diaz]

I remember growing up in Portugal (big Roma community) and the horrible discrimination against them there. We had a lovely family that lived in the forest behind our property that were all deaf and only their little 10 year old daughter could translate and talk for them. Not all people are scammers and thieves

 

[rick]

I remember growing up in Portugal (big Roma community) and the horrible discrimination against them there. We had a lovely family that lived in the forest behind our property that were all deaf and only their little 10 year old daughter could translate and talk for them. Not all people are scammers and thieves

I will say this one more time, generalisations are based in fact.

Get it into your head.

http://www.france24.com/en/20100830-france-hortefeux-besson-roma-crime-deportation-racism

"France’s Interior Minister Brice Hortefeux said on Monday that over the past 18 months crime committed by Roma people has increased by 259 percent in Paris alone."

“Today, in Paris, the reality is that almost one in five perpetrators of a theft is a Romanian,” Hortefeux said on Wednesday at the joint press conference with immigration minister Eric Besson. “This is not about stigmatising this or that population, but we cannot close our eyes to reality.”

 

[e-smile]

if I follow your logic : racism has increased in France = all french are racist = so are the interior and the immigration minister = can't trust them when they talk about Romanians.